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Indian Real Estate prices: How I made fool of myself

Indian Real Estate has been one of the high riding sectors since 2002- 2003. After very bad ninetees decade, it has resurrected itself like never before. Infact, in last three to four years, the property market in India has zoomed by more than 300% in few cities. When I bought my first house in 2000 in Pune, India, the housing market was was just starting to show the glimpse of what was in store for future, however what followed over next 5-6 years has been beyond anyone’s expectation and has been a dream run for Indian construction Industry.

But what about the future ? Will it still keep going up the monemtum ? Will it remain constant ? or will it take a U turn ?
These are the million dollar questions for you and me.

My younger cousin called me yesterday from India. His builder had called him up to tell that the township where he had bought the 3 Bedroom flat was near completion and should recieve the possession in a month.

Why did he specifically call me and tell me this ?

It is because I had given him an advice against making the house investment last December. I told him “the property market has moved too high in a short period of time. It may just collapse. It may not be a good time for you to buy. You should see consolidation in property market shortly. Wait for 6 months to a year and you will get much lower rates”

How proud was he that he had made the right decision of buying the house because the real estate market in India is still going strong. Every one knows the success of Biggest real estate IPO in India “DLF”!

What he told me later was even more surprising. Last December, when he bought the flat, he got a rate Rs. 2300/- per sq. ft. (approx $60 psf ). During his recent visit to his apartment, he asked the builder about current rates. He was overjoyed to hear that rates had climbed to Rs. 3600/- per sq.ft. (approx $90 psf).
A huge jump of around 60% over December 06 rates !

I felt like hiding my face for the advice I had given him, it made me look so foolish.

So what advice will you give me, If I decide to book a new apartment in India, specifically Pune ?

You can leave your suggestion as a comment or go ahead and take a poll, it takes only a second !

Note: If you are viewing this post through your email or Rss reader please click here or here to vote.

About Arun Prabhudesai

Arun Prabhudesai is founder / chief editor at trak.in. He jumped the Entrepreneurship bandwagon in early 2008 after a long 13 year stint in I.T Industry. You can follow him on twitter @trakin and Facebook. Arun’s Google+ Profile


  1. Unless and untill people wait to buy the property, its rates are not going to reduce. People should wait, then and then only builders will realize that there property is not worth selling at such a high price. What actually happens is that we go on buying with 80-85% home loans with banks. We don’t think of future, the rate of interest thats going to increase due to increasing inflation (thanks to our underperforming Govt. and also human nature for having short memory for they forgot everything after Anna Hazare struggle). The 15 years tenure for home loan goes to 20 years. The property that we bought goes to a lesser value than what we paid with principle + interest to bank. We don’t think these things. We just go on buying depending on home loans. Whats the result, builders think that we can pay, so they rise the price (thanks to their unity). What we think is that price may go more high, so we go searching and we book an apartment before anybody else do it. And then afterwards we come to know about rise in RR, rise in rate of interest. And the cycle continues. Just quoting that it will reduce will not do anything. Wait or not buy. This may do. Only solution is my friends, don’t buy till the builders association realize that the prices should be reduced. Have patience.

  2. Dear Friend, I am leaving in Pune since last 2.5 years on a renten basis and planning to buy 2 bhk flat near & arround in Kothrud area but day by day the price are incresing like any thing 2 years back when I have started to buy a flat in Pune it was arround Rs.4000/- per sq ft in Kothrud & surrounding area now it is reached to 6K to 7k . Property price in Pune never seems to be fall down in Pune or the holding capacity of Builder loby is very strong resulting the property price increse like madely. Kindly advice me in comming few month or in 2012 can see 30 to 40% correction in proeprty price in Pune???

  3. Just check at the magic brick. Looks like reality price fall has already started. You can see panic selling by resellers in Pune

  4. Now I am in market for property for Pune in Wakad for myself to stay in. Although I am not in Pune, I am buying now because I believe I will not be able to buy 2 years from now in 2012 when I move in as it will be too expensive then. Prices in Aundh, Kalyani Nagar and Gurgaon makes me believe prices can go up. Quick look at launch prices made me rethink about new flat as a 3 BHK is over 60L and beyond my reach. Hence I am going for re-sale flat. I think a lot of discussion has been around price of new property in Pune. Re-sale property value seems to be 10-15% less than new and I am not sure if the re-sale values are going up as well at same rate. My perception is that re-sale market will be stunted until new inventory keeps hitting the area. Once area is saturated then it goes up. Further when facilities develop it goes up again. I can definitely see saturation coming in Wakad. I can’t say that about facilities in Pune. That might that 20 years. Saturation can take value upto Rs 5000 psf I think. Good facilities, maybe to 10,000. Just my thoughts. Would like to know other’s opinion? And what would be life of a typical Wakad property? You know we look at house rent as retirement income option. I am not sure how long they will survive with basic maintenance.


  6. Rajesh Arjunlal Jaisingh

    Very interesting Comments section here and it has helped record the “psyche” of a microcosm of Pune Realty watchers from 2007! Nice – it was helpful. Some notes on the current scenario: Positives for builders: 1. A lot of “anxious” wannabe-buyers have balked in the last 6 months to buy up properties for “actual use”. Note that there is a rising tide of 10 lk+ households that “need” to save taxes (Property Loans offer the highest tax-breaks) and also buy their first homes. I have seen people buy what they liked after 15% price-cuts allowing builders to stay put with prices and actually increase them in the last few months of 2009-onwards. This created a mini stampede to buy at least at the existing “low” prices! 2. Many builders shelved projects or slowed them down to the detriment of existing buyers – there have been delays but there are not too many instances of buyers backing out due to this. They have had to bear the delays! 3. A lot of money is sloshing around in the economy waiting to reinvest in property as a big chunk of this money has come from selling older properties the profits of which will attract taxes unless invested in real estate again – there are not too many alternatives but to deploy these funds back into property (at current prices) within a year. Little discussed, this one fact is helping builders and promoters a lot! 4. Lets admit it – people are making a lot more money today – businesses, govt employees, property owners and the salaried class have all had it good (most cases – not all!) for the last few years. They can afford to pay more for good property – so, why would they not? Positives for buyers: 1. Those who have already “bought” should rest easy – prices are not going to “Crash” unless a major economic disaster hits us again! Expect corrections though… else, its a flat-line all the way for some time. 2. Those who are “looking to buy” will be able to find a few deals if they look hard but don’t expect 2004-05 prices anymore! The cost of construction today is more than the prices in those years. 3. There is still a possibility for some over-stretched builders to go under and this could lead to some good properties hitting the market at decent prices or “bad” properties come up as distress-sale deals. Sharp investors will grab them quickly. Overall: I see that the sharp price rise trends of circa 2003 to 2007 have all but disappeared. While there was a dip post 2007 this is fast being caught up to. Looks like we are heading to a 2007-price flattening out. Do not expect stupendous gains in property over the next 3-5 years unless you are predicting a particular area to gain increased economic value due to infrastructural developments (would love to hear about this localities!). Positives for renters: Rentals are “extremely” low by investment standards for an investor to expect any decent returns on this front. I personally know of cases where property owners in “posh” localities of Pune get sub-2% returns on their property. Pathetic for investment but good for renters who can enjoy living in a property that costs in the 8-figures but is down-right affordable for even the salaried class! Expect this trend to only increase as more households “invest” in second homes and these houses hit the rental-market. All the views above are mine and while I belong to the investor community, I have tried to be as neutral as possible. Happy to catch up on a cup of coffee with anyone who would like to discuss in greater detail! :) Warm regards, Raj rajeshaj@gmail.com

  7. i am looking to buy flats for investment purpose with a 3 yr horizon with a budget of 35 lacs. I see from this blog for the past 3 years everyone would be speculating and worrying and no one wud have bought a flat. Should I continue this legacy or someone can give a splendid advice ?

  8. It is always good to invest in real estate & the information provided is also very useful hence nowadays i am looking for luxurious homes pune

  9. Hey dac, it is good to revisit threads. I just did too :) Prices in Pune have come down so it is incorrect to say nothing has changed. A fine example is Nanded City booking prices (3200psf) and prevailing rates (2500psf). Is it the right time, I don’t know. I still am not comfortable with the rates. I don’t see value being delivered for my money. Someone long time back on this thread asked about property in Chakan because of some airport coming there. I had advised then it may not come. Here are 3 news articles in different points of time. The latest one talks about it being ready sometime by 2020 :) 14-may-2009: http://www.indianexpress.com/news/new-chakan-airport-still-miles-away/458822/ 8-dec-2009: http://in.news.yahoo.com/48/20091208/804/tnl-rs-7-000-crore-chakan-airport-new-de.html 9-jan-2010: http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/city/pune/Proposed-airport-near-Chakan-wont-happen-for-10-yrs/articleshow/5426315.cms The bottom line is there is too much speculation going on in Pune. It is one of the most riskiest places to bet on. In the coming years, Pune has more downfall to see than growth. I think this thread has done and would continue to do something good for those who can think and reason. It has provided so many viewpoints on this subject.

  10. Hi Ranjeet, I am back after a long time to this thread. I believe this thread has been since last two years (at least). I don’t know how many guys have been waiting waiting specially after your commnets to buy the house. I don’t see anyone from this thread has bought the house and said that your comments saved xx amount of money. However I am not in touch with the current siutation of Real Estate in Pune but whatever I heard from my friends in Pune nothing has been changed drastically. As always I have been telling if anyone wants a house to live any time is the right time. –DAC

  11. Roopa, PM Said it right!!!!!!!! You have excess money save it as the days ahead are going to be VERY TOUGH – VERY HARD and every peny will count. He who is financially sound shall overcome it without making dire compromises. It is going to be really very tough starting Mid-2010 – take it for granted…..


  13. Roopa, I gather that you only want to invest your money in RE and are not looking for an ashiana. Days of real estate being an investment vehicle are gone. I say this because prevailing RE prices are more than their fair value (specially in Pune). In such an instance, only one thing happens – correction, which is now LONG DUE in Pune. Till any of this happens, you would just see prices hovering around a point. Now have the prices really fallen to a point where they start making sense? I don’t think so. There is nothing right for investment today. Everything seems to be so much overvalued to me – Gold, Stocks, RE. One can only hedge today by spreading across these investments and expect not to take a loss (forget gains). The best decision one can make in such an economy is to SPEND. Buy that big car you always wanted. Stay in a posh locality and much bigger houses like 3-5 BHK as rents are cheaper. Take that vacation. Buy those furnishings. Right now enjoy life with your hard earned money. Good Luck.

  14. Hello, i have beengoing thru the comments on this blog – well i have ended up very confused i need to invest in a 2 bhk but my budget is only 25 lacs i really liked magarpatta city but its going beyond – can somebody pls. comment on how is dsk as an investment – will the price go up or i should wait for magarpatta to come down

  15. ** PROPERTY SALES DIP IN FY 09-10 ** PROPERTRY ISN’T SELLING AS IT IS TOUTED LOUD BY BUILDERS – EUPHORIA CREATED IS A HOAX – FOLLOW BELOW LINK – http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/markets/real-estate/realty-trends/Dip-in-property-sales-hits-stamp-duty-collection/articleshow/5238111.cms



  18. Anyone know whats the current flat rates @bapat road?

  19. READ THIS AS WELL – IT IS A CLEAR NEXUS BETWEEN “” MIDDLE MEN “” & “” BUILDERS “” THEY ARE FOOLING US BY CLAIMING RAPID SALE OF THEIR PROPERTIES. JUST IMAGINE THEY ARE GOING TO ANY EXTENT – ANY KIND OF MANIPULATION – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-developers/real-estate-sector-still-deprived-of-genuine-demand.html#more-3144 http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-developers/real-estate-developer-parsvnath-to-raise-rs-600-cr-by-selling-stakes-in-realty-projects.html


  21. Today I visited Row house@Ravi Park in Manjiri , 4 Km from Magarpatta. I liked the the township and at first glace I got impressed by roads and open space. Builder is asking for 35 lac. Does anybody know about this builder ? It is worth to inverst 35 lac in Row house at Ravi Work ? what should be the fair price in this area ? I expects some good comments .. Thanks in advance Tx. Dharmendra

  22. I can very well tell you the right time to buy property in Pune, wait for another 6 months :)

  23. GUYS!! Need your expert comments. Would it make sense to buy a bungalow in Vadagaon, Talegaon which is still under-developed, giving price advantages over Pune city, and travel 20 kms to Hinjewadi IT park? Isn’t it better than staying in a flat and paying high prices to buy. My guess is, if you take old Mumbai-Puna bypass way, you should be in Hinjewadi in approx. 35-40 minutes… Isn’t that called a normal travel in India? I would appreciate your responses, the pluses and minuses living in a rural area such as vadagon, talegaon…..Tk care.

  24. Well Said Ranjeet.Can you please tell me when is the right time to buy property in pune? this year end or next year?Can you please give us some specific time frame.

  25. Wait untill election results. If current govt rejected rates will be definately down… See my ear;ier post abt gold..it is increasing.. regards, ranjeet

  26. Hi, The builders in Pimple saudagar have incresed theie rate again. In jan 2009 the prevailing rates were 2100~2700. Now they have increased it to 2500~2900. In one of the projects that the older rate was 2500 and now as of today they are quoting 2850 :). The NSE & BSE are showing a positive trend. It seems that the builders are not going to bow down due to their large profits made, and its the buyer who is going to suffer.People have been advising me to hold the decision from Jan and to wait for 6 more monts (every month I get the same advice.). I dont see any price correction. Some of my friends who struck the deal in early this year seem to quite lucky and sensible to me now :( as their properties have appreciated in just 6 months of time.

  27. Hello All It was good reading through the comments threads. Any idea about Kumar Paradise by Kumar Properties near Magerpatta city? The rate and how is the place to stay and approach to Hinjewadi and other IT parks. Thanks

  28. @Satya: Very Good Story. While some of it is hypothetical it still delivers the message good enough. We always thought that there is a land scarcity in India due to population. If that was the case, why there are so many empty flats, why builders are struggling to sell real estate, why the monthly rents are much cheaper than the actual EMI + Maintenance paid, these are all signs of the bubble. This reminds me of 1992 era… I was still in Std. XII but my dad had booked flats because the prices were going up every 2 weeks. In 2000, when we tried to sell those, prices were slashed down at least by 30%. I think wise men here will wait until the real estate correction happens.

  29. Want to share small story i read somewhere. Read and wake up before it is too late – Once there was a little island country. The land of this country was the tiny island itself. The total money in circulation was 2 dollars as there were only two pieces of 1 dollar coins circulating around. 1) There were 3 citizens living on this island country. A owned the land. B and C each owned 1 dollar. 2) B decided to purchase the land from A for 1 dollar. So, now A and C own 1 dollar each while B owned a piece of land that is worth 1 dollar. * The net asset of the country now = 3 dollars. 3) Now C thought that since there is only one piece of land in the country, and land is non producible asset, its value must definitely go up. So, he borrowed 1 dollar from A, and together with his own 1 dollar, he bought the land from B for 2 dollars. *A has a loan to C of 1 dollar, so his net asset is 1 dollar. * B sold his land and got 2 dollars, so his net asset is 2 dollars. * C owned the piece of land worth 2 dollars but with his 1 dollar debt to A, his net residual asset is 1 dollar. * Thus, the net asset of the country = 4 dollars. 4) A saw that the land he once owned has risen in value. He regretted having sold it. Luckily, he has a 1 dollar loan to C. He then borrowed 2 dollars from B and acquired the land back from C for 3 dollars. The payment is by 2 dollars cash (which he borrowed) and cancellation of the 1 dollar loan to C. As a result, A now owned a piece of land that is worth 3 dollars. But since he owed B 2 dollars, his net asset is 1 dollar. * B loaned 2 dollars to A. So his net asset is 2 dollars. * C now has the 2 coins. His net asset is also 2 dollars. * The net asset of the country = 5 dollars. A bubble is building up. (5) B saw that the value of land kept rising. He also wanted to own the land. So he bought the land from A for 4 dollars. The payment is by borrowing 2 dollars from C, and cancellation of his 2 dollars loan to A. * As a result, A has got his debt cleared and he got the 2 coins. His net asset is 2 dollars. * B owned a piece of land that is worth 4 dollars, but since he has a debt of 2 dollars with C, his net Asset is 2 dollars. * C loaned 2 dollars to B, so his net asset is 2 dollars. * The net asset of the country = 6 dollars; even though, the country has only one piece of land and 2 Dollars in circulation. (6) Everybody has made money and everybody felt happy and prosperous. (7) One day an evil wind blew, and an evil thought came to C’s mind. “Hey, what if the land price stop going up, how could B repay my loan. There is only 2 dollars in circulation, and, I think after all the land that B owns is worth at most only 1 dollar, and no more.” (8) A also thought the same way. (9) Nobody wanted to buy land anymore. * So, in the end, A owns the 2 dollar coins, his net asset is 2 dollars. * B owed C 2 dollars and the land he owned which he thought worth 4 dollars is now 1 dollar. So his net asset is only 1 dollar. * C has a loan of 2 dollars to B. But it is a bad debt. Although his net asset is still 2 dollars, his Heart is palpitating. * The net asset of the country = 3 dollars again. (10) So, who has stolen the 3 dollars from the country ? Of course, before the bubble burst B thought his land was worth 4 dollars. Actually, right before the collapse, the net asset of the country was 6 dollars on paper. B’s net asset is still 2 dollars, his heart is palpitating. (11) B had no choice but to declare bankruptcy. C as to relinquish his 2 dollars bad debt to B, but in return he acquired the land which is worth 1 dollar now. * A owns the 2 coins, his net asset is 2 dollars. * B is bankrupt, his net asset is 0 dollar. ( he lost everything ) * C got no choice but end up with a land worth only 1 dollar * The net asset of the country = 3 dollars.

  30. Buyers beware of the Broker-Builder nexus of under-writing of projects… Brokers are increasingly underwriting properties in new projects being launched by developers—blocking a large number of apartments during so-called soft-launches, hoping to offload them at a premium to end-buyers after the formal launch. This will help builders claim huge sales immediately and create an artificial scarcity in the market. Check the article below that talks about it http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Market-News/NCR-brokers-do-a-realty-check-again/articleshow/4926417.cms VK

  31. Guys, I don’t know what drives all you potential buyers…but for me its the following:- 1. Historically, affordable house prices are of the order of upto 3 times your annual salary. That way, you can move on to better things in life once you’ve got a place to stay. Right now I am looking at stifling EMIs till retirement (and that’s hoping one doesn’t get the salaries slashed relative to inflation, recession etc etc). 2. When I said “house”, I meant a place with a good approach road, regular water and electricity, clean air and an easy commute to your work and to places like the airport, hospital, schools, railway station etc. 3. Ain’t builder societies a farce? You own a house but still continue to pay every month in the name of society charges? This is a recent phenomenon of the last decade. 4. Why buy when a 50 Lac flat fetches you a bare 15K rent? Might as well let your money multiply in a bank. Logically, if it doubles in 7 years, you’ll have a crore. Now ask yourself, do you believe all those 50 Lac flats would become a Crore in the next 7 years? Will salaries grow so fast to find buyers still? 5. Yes, maybe property will continue to rise till such time there is no one left who can afford a house. But I am not going to be the guinea pig for this grand experiment! WAIT AND ENJOY SEEING YOUR SAVINGS MULTIPLY IN YOUR OWN PASSBOOK RATHER THEN THESE BUILDERS’ COFFER. I can already see hard cash of 7 Lacs (after taxes, rentals and a good life) sitting pretty in my account ever since I decided not to buy a house 2 years ago. This is as against a possible debt of 30 Lacs and an EMI of god knows how much for the next 20 years which I feel fortunate to have escaped.

  32. Hi. I’m planning to invest in a 2/3 BHK apartment in Project Acolade,Kharadi Pune. It looked appealing and cost-effective comparitevly..Close to 2850 / Sft. I’ve checked with the A slot of residents staying in the last 2 yrs and no one complained on water issues as PMC is providing well. It’s a hard rumour that Kharadi still suffers with Water Issues. If anyone thinks of Acolade as a bad idea please advice.

  33. How about NIBM. Is it any good? Is the rate of 2650 good? Is hasn’t decreased in the last year. While many other places have decreased by up to 33%. I have a budget of about 25-30 lakhs for a 2BHK, any advices? Thanks

  34. Hi, The rates r dropped, but there is ample scope of further drop. Inspite of huge Ads flats r not selling due to no buyers ihn mkt. Pl read prvious posts. With the new Tax code, the investors will start to dump further flats in mkt. Estimate abt 3-4 k Flats in Kharadi and dependent on Tanker water and no roads, waiting for buyers or rentals.

  35. How is Baner & Kharadi to buy a 3-4BHK flat? Would appreciate if you could post the schemes along with current rates.

  36. One of the reason why we as buyers should form a group and not buy underconstruction apartments. 1000 psf or 9000 psf; if u r not going to get the flat no use to discuss property rates. We as buyers in combination should make sure that we buy only completed housing… then the builders would have no choice but to sell flats that have been completed…… but alas i know this will not happen… http://www.mumbaimirror.com/article/2/2009072720090727021437812dbe1e3b2/Paying-rents-and-EMIs.html


  38. Hi man, There is a duplex in Maurya society 2bhk for 75 Lakhs. Paper Ad The society is very quit on Naylor road. Good for own stay. House has its own garden, parking etc. Atur park is right in front. Brahma Suncity has quoted rate 4500 psf for phase- II if u r ready to pay in atleast half cash. However this is upfront offer by salesman, and i suspect it would be much lower when u will actually negotiate. By the way resale flats r available in Phase – I at 2900-3200 psf. The project is Huge with all amenities already available so the construction will continue for quit some time. The rates are on downward spiral, suggest wait for the effect of budget to further depress the sentiments and market. Also the election r round the corner the prices r sure to come down to finance the political parties. Rates r the costliest in Koregaon park area,

  39. I had seen an initiative on this forum to form an association before, now i dont see any update..so I thought let me put this and find out if anyone knows about other groups formed in past.. ? I had read about a group of some 100 Infosys people came together and had invited builders to start a project for them on mutually agreeable terms. http://bit.ly/2IFnHf While reading that, I came to know about this group ITWAP which says it has started a project in sus gaon and they are in land registration stage.. http://dir.groups.yahoo.com/group/ITPWAP/ Anybody knows anything about the fate of these two initiatives ?

  40. sansei I was in Pune last week and had checked out Fortleza and Brahma Suncity. Forteliza 2nd phase is complete and the new building has excellent location and view of swimming pool, club house, kids play area. However I was quoted a price of 1 crore 9 lk (@ 6,000 per sq ft) which is a little over my budget. I then went to see Brahma Suncity. The sales person showed me phase 2 sample flat of 1700+ sqft @ 5,000 rs+ per sq ft. negotiable. You mentioned why not buy in Koregaon park.. Actually I am new to Pune, I live in mumbai but hardly got a chance to go to Pune. This was first time I went there. Can you tell me good locations in Koregaon park and/or kalyani nagar, or any other posh localities that could fit my budget? and if possible also tell me what society I should go and check out? There is one sunshine court opp to Forteliza there rawhouse of 2000 sqft is quoting 90 lk, how is that deal? Are prices really going to go down? Should I wait? Many thanks all…

  41. For the original stuff: http://beta.esakal.com/Search.aspx?srchkey=FSI

  42. History of official support: 10 yrs back, PMC started the concept of TDR’s – transfer of development rights. bldrs received additional 40% built up permission. However, due to Scams and blame game on officials, these became stricter and finally uneconomical. The bldrs started using Slum rehab projects to garner greater FSI to increase their profits. Their sole aim was profit and profits – leave aside the houses for poor. They r the loyal followers of the netas. Bldrs started to exploit the loop holes in bldg laws. They used the premiums to close open galleries for flats, they charged the free FSI for staircase and open parkings to their customers and reaped more and more profits. Then the special town ship projects came into being. But the bldrs had to comply stricter rules on water, waste management, etc etc etc… The responsibilty seems an everlasting commitment. So it did not find many takers…. So the new FSI gimmick Another aspect, they r planning to give State transport corporation land on 3 FSI to private bldrs for commercial use on 2/3 of total prop. This move is ostensibly to provide revenue to STC. Poor STC was running on losses all these yrs, nobody bothered. Now it has started showing revival – the vultures r out to finance the election on their lands

  43. Down rates ——————————————————————————– Hi , The election moves have started . PMC is mulling of increasing the FSI. Presently Gaothan area has FSI 2 and other suburbs 1; These will be doubled. This is supported by one and all. Profits to bldrs – monies in elections. So the money pressure eases for bldrs. Buyers beware the bldrs will now increase the constructions in projects, floors etc etc etc… But where is the monies when there r not many buyers in markets Loads of FSI /TDRs doesn’t produce money only selling does So the pressure is only going to increase. This was origianlly fm Sakal. posted it in another blog.

  44. Hi,, i want ot invest in some property in chakan,can anyone tell me how this area is for good incvestment..or plz advise where can i buy a house with the best value… my budget is 15 lacs

  45. The budget has not provided the much hyped relief to Aam Admi- read the bldrs. Result sentiments down . c the stock market reaction. The Fm has not even kept the previous good feelings and expectations! The Fiscal deficit targetted at 6.9% what will be the final? No major disinvestment. No infra announcement only intent! hah! No housing boost, no income tax relief. On top of it the pending elections in Maha. The monies have to come out man to fund these parties. Just c the opening moves: Increase in FSI (doubling) in Pune under consideration at PMC. LOL! It is not going to produce monies for the bldrs, unless they r able to sell the flats. So friends these people r going to under pressure SURE till election. Scout and cherry pick

  46. Hi, Nautanki, fortezela or slice of paradise had very bad vibes two yrs back. Was in headlines for variety of reasons. Poor residents had hell instead of paradise. Rates r exhorbitant, present situation u go and c for urself. Nyati meadows and Brahma Sun-city are good. U might like to visit their lounge and c Katrina promos. No connectivity at present. A long narrow winding road thro’ Wad gaon sheri, where even if a bus passes u, u get stuck for some mins with 2 wheelers/cycles crawling over u. Brahma has 101 amenities and huge front gate in constrast of Nyati. Beware u have a 750 pm maintenance charge and some amenities are chargeable per person per usage like club house rs100 per person etc. The quoted rates are 3100 psf for resale/investor flats and nego. The bldr rep had quoted 4500 psf nego. for the new Phase -II booking. The ph-II has centralised AC, e-facilities etc etc etc….. Abt connectivity, only a single plot separates these bldgs from the two lane road coming fm Adlabs , Kalyaninagar. Another road is planned along the riverside in DP joining near bridge on Bypass road. There is Cerebrum two bldgs, Nyati Tech park in this area under construction. if u have 80 lk, why not buy in Maurya society duplex on naylor road going at 75 lk for quite some time. or in Koregaon Park itself.

  47. VK, Avoid Kumar Kruti. Project has been stopped twice. Booking rate when opened 2nd time was INR 2200/sq ft. Project is delayed. Approach road is from Nagar rd. & not Kumar City. Btw, Fortaleza is going for INR 4000/sq ft nego in resale but several complaints are about Fortaleza too. Suncity resale doing rounds for INR 2900-3200/sq ft .

  48. sansei, I have enjoyed ur posts on other forum. I would suggest you post your recomendation on the areas that you have seen. like kharadi, hadapsar etc

  49. This is my first post to this blog and I am new to Pune. I want to buy my home in Pune in a good posh area and one of the best apartment complex. So far I liked only 2 places. Fortaleza and Brahmna Suncity. Can anyone please suggest me what should be the price of 2 BHK and 3 BHK in there? Any other good posh location for budget of 80 lk for 3 bhk? Thanks…

  50. Hi Guys, I think i have missed the real discussions these past year. No worry! Will pull some more bloggers into this site for more meaningful info for u folk. Personally, have dealt in Property and now looking for apartmant in east Pune for self use. If any one wants to exchange notes do so. Have seen some in Kharadi,Wagholi,Dhanori, Wadgaonsheri and little in Vimannagar. The rates do seem to hardening a little bit. But where r the genuine buyers??? Election round the corner, the monies of the bldrs, cronies,proxies have to come out for funding. With NCP in dire straits the fund requirements due to free bies in election would be HUGE. I expect property prices to be under pressure atleast till election for sure. How do i subcribe to the new post. and lively discussion.

  51. What’s happening .. ??? Is this blog dead .. ???? no updates since long time .. ??

  52. but what if the market picks up by then my dear… ?

  53. @ sankar Yaar wait till diwali.. There will be a good correction again.. Ranjeet

  54. Guys, what do you think, if I have to make a choice between Park Street and Magarpatta City Township, which one is better? Magarpatta has rates slightly higher than Park street. On phone, I was quoted psf rate for Magarpatta = 3330 while the Park street = 2850. When I was searching internet to find reviews about park street, I found grieviance slides about Five Gardens, which is also Pride & Purple’s construction. If there is anyone already living in Park street, your suggestions would definitely help. Thanks!!

  55. @Sanskar The township and the living here is quite good. (I stay, rented ) But the rate is over hyped. I was quoted 3250 3months ago, I left w/o doing any negotiation. In resale, the rate was around 2800, I think if you wait it will come down even below that.

  56. How is Magarpatta city township, Can anyone tell me the pluses and minuses… I am getting a rate of 3300 psf.

  57. I personally saw this week that one of most premiere builders of India, reducing the rate by 15% in the first face-to-face meeting after initial talk. It’s a big under construction project in Bangalore where structures are ready, possession in mid next year.

  58. Dear All, It is very risky to link the stock market with real estate prices in current economic framework. The numbers of Investors that got hit by Investing their money in real estate will never think of to reinvest in real estate. Though picture is again favourable. It is very hard to say that all things will go in correct direction. Revival of any economy generally takes almost one year to reboost. The common man who should be real buyer will not easily forget the crunches of those who lost their wealth in last real estate boom. I saw so many brockers seat empty or choose other profession due to recession. Again the question comes with holding power of builders. They have very strong holding power & its possiblity that the capital they are using whether fixed or working is come through balck market. That’s why they are not ready to cut down rates as they ought to cut. But small builders reduced their prices in last year with drastic differences. But see whether they have made any mess in raw material qulality in order to book good margins. Again The major impact in raw material cost is that of steel & cement. Though steel rates are declined, cement manufcatureres are playing safe by creating joint monopoly. They even indirectly banned cheap cement by imposing heavy import duty on cement procured from Pakistan. It is high possibility that the same bans will be write off in near future. Hence you will save lot in upcoming projects if we expect ethical businese practices from builders. Ranjeet

  59. Found a very interesting article on moneycontrol. Maybe some of you would have gone thru it. Interesting to note that the PSF construction cost mentioned here is only around Rs 600. ================================ A real estate crash is good for you; and India! CONVENTIONAL economics says a crash is bad. In reality, however, it’s a boon. A real estate crash is an economic blessing for billions of people and the country. Two years back, no one would have imagined that real estate prices could crash by 50 per cent. Today, it’s a fact. Compared to peak prices of 2008, you can expect a correction by 70 per cent in the coming years. Despite that a lot of properties will be lying vacant as there is a huge oversupply – in India and all over the world. Many builders and brokers will probably send me hate mails for saying this but the fact remains that a 70 per cent crash is a good time for them to create much more wealth and to tap a large market. This crash is excellent for home buyers, businesses, and the entire economy. Reason: A lot more cash is available for more productive activities in the economy such as building roads, electricity, etc. How is that? Let us say earlier a property you wanted to buy was being quoted at Rs 1 crore. To get money to buy this, you might have to scour your entire life savings and take additional loans. You and your family might have to slave for at least 20 years to pay off the EMIs to banks. A lot of your savings gets sucked into unproductive assets like real estate. Today cost of construction per square foot is only around Rs 600. Based on this a 1000 sq. ft apartment should cost not more than Rs 6 lakhs to construct. Just imagine a flat that cost barely 6 lakh to construct is being sold for Rs 1 crore. A few might argue – that we need to consider land costs. Land cost is artificially inflated across the country – India has an abundance of land all across. Just move out of the major cities and you will see thousands of acres of vacant land. Now imagine if that same property is available for Rs 20 lakh, which is the fair value for such a property. Now there is an additional Rs 80 lakh available in the economy for more productive uses. What happens to this surplus of Rs 80 lakh? Previously, only a small minority of builders enjoyed this surplus of Rs 80 lakh but now it can be invested to boost consumption. Roads, factories and new service industries can boom if each family uses this Rs 80 lakh more productively. Electricity, roads, water, health care and education will get a huge boost from this money. No amount of interest reduction or artificial stimulus package can have the same effect as this. When property prices go down, automatically the ‘black cash’ element would disappear. People would not see the need to find the back alleys to pay Rs 20 lakh. The question, you should ask! Today, a place like Dubai, which has sunk billions of dollars into unproductive real estate, is on the verge of collapse. Had they utilised this money for better use, the economy would have been much better today. A lot more of this crash is excellent for the economy. The real estate crash has not yet happened in India and is still to come and will probably surprise a lot of people. India has a bright future ahead and millions of new jobs are going to be created. A lot of new capital also is going to be used productively thanks to this global economic crash. I’ll once again stress that this is one of the best opportunities in history to create immense wealth for all those who are armed with knowledge and have a little bit of patience. =======================

  60. Darshit let me try to explain myself. I hope it adds to and clarifies some of the things that I mentioned above. >>So as per your logic , these fellow people have done nothing so why should they make money. Is that so?? Not exactly, sorry maybe I was not clear enough. I am referring only to the Builders with 1st hand flats and not the resale market. I was referring to the Builders Cost psf which is approx 600-800 psf. So the diff in cost for them is largely of acquiring the land which should ideally reflect in the selling price accordingly. Maybe an example would help let me try. Let’s say a Builder builds an apartment complex of 100 Flats of 1000 sq ft area and sells it at 1500 psf. Total revenue = 100 X 1000 X 1500 = Rs. 15 Cr. (I am assuming he is making a decent profit here) Same Builder builds similar apartment like above in some other area.. 100 Flats of 1000 sq ft area and sells it at 4500 psf.. Total revenue = 100 X 1000 X 4500 = Rs. 45 Cr. The different in the above 2 case. 45-15 = Rs. 30Cr should majorly be due to the cost of acquiring land and some odd taxes. Please correct me if I am wrong but is there such a huge difference in the cost of land that the builders demand such high rates. (The only close relation that I can think of to get the rates is to check the rates of individual houses / bungalows sold in these areas and take a reference of the land price) >> so first see what you want , check whether you can afford it and last try and understand of the stability , project worth of itself….. Cannot afford on my own. Can afford with the help of a Loan. If I take a loan I work hard and pay interest and principal back. Have little left for myself to spend on other things. Maybe can handle basic necessities for 10-15 years of my life. Meanwhile the builder has made a huge killing by selling me the flat and owns luxuries in the multiples. The Banks executive has made a nice safe interest income as well. All this at what cost? My cost!!! 10-15 years of my life earning and paying a huge EMI for owning an apartment. Somewhere I personally don’t feel it is worth taking such a huge load on my head, >>your e.g. of decorator , you didnt say in which city / area was this….. were there not enough options around. was availibility of an alternative an issue.. what made you to fall prey ?? or was ths some nexus like PBAP ;) This was in Mumbai and yes it is the same in every hotel so if I did not go to Hotel X then I would go to Hotel Y and they would have a fixed decorator who would charge exorbitant rates. Do u remember the dialogue from “China Gate”.. “Mere mann ko Bhaya mai Kutta kaat ke khaya”.. it is on similar lines… these guys quote what ever unke mann ko bhaya as there is no one to question them. Cheers, VK

  61. I have been reading this blog since last year and is very much informative. I also heard from news papers, news, friends that property prices are going up and if we want to invest then better to do it before Diwali 2009. How far is this true? Please count me in if you are planning on HBA meet. A telecon would be great. I am basically looking for a peaceful community with reasonable prices. A home that you would like to go to, after work. Not much noisy, good people, safe neighbourhood for kids. (My budget is 40 Lakhs, 3 BHK, approx. 1200-1300 sq. ft). Do you guys have any suggestion, on any areas or projects that I should specifically look in?

  62. Guys… Here ‘s some update on the propery market. Since my office is loacted in Hijjewadi,I was planning to buy a 2BHK flat in Pimple Saudagar,also it has good potentiial to growin future with PCMC project of connecting it with Aundh by a four lane road. I had sorted out 3-4 flats each in Rose valley & Roseland Rhythem,both projects by GK developers.I researched all the projects in & around like Swiss County by Rama group,Ganesh from wadhwani,but zeroed on these two projects. The feedback given bout GK developers was relatively better than the other developers in the vicinity apart from the construction quality,timely completion of projects ,amenities etc. In March end I was given a quote of 2400 psf for both Rose Valley & Rhythem.I was planning to buy that time itself but could not for market & job conditions. Finally I made up my mind I again took quotes :2600 psf, A RISE OF 200 IN @ MONTHS ITSELF. This was the rate I got after 3 rounds on negotiations.I was still in some dilemma whether to wait for some more time or to go for it.This again resulted in delay of 2-3 weeks. Finally me & my wife went to the buliders office with a mindset to purchase the flat.TO MY SURPRISE THE 2 FLATS WHICH WE HAD SHORTLISTED SOME 3 WEEKS AGO WERE ALL SOLD.THERE WAS SUCH A MAD RUSH IN THE OFFFICE THAT WE HAD TO WAIT FOR 40 MINS FOR OUR TURN TO COME. INITIALLY I THOUGHT IT ANOTHER OF THOSE BUILDER’S TRICJK TO PERSUADE ME TO BOOK EARLY BUT I SAW HIS BOOKING REGISTER.ALL THE FLATS WHICH WE HAD THOUGHT WERE BOOKED. IN FACT IN FRONT OF MY EYES 3 FLATS WERE BOOKED IN RAJVEER PALACE. People even dint bothered to think much .it was a fish market kind of stiff with every one thinking to buy before it finishes off. SINCE THE OPTIONS WHICH WE HAD SHORTLISTED WERE ALREADY BOOKED,WE LEFT THE PLACE AS THERE WAS NO PLAN TO INVEST MY HARD EARNED MONEY IN “SECOND RUNG” FLATS. Me & my wife were compelled to think who says there is dearth of money,recession,lay offs in the market.The people purchsed definitely contradicts this all. I was heart broken as I never thought all the options would run short. I chatted with other so called investor to know the rates & this is what they got 2800 psf!!! with possession in Dec end & 1.75L for covered parking !!! overall amounting to 33 L including stamp duty regis etc. Surely this is atleast 5L more than my budget. I’m regret my decision not to buy in March tself when the same flat would have costed my 28 L with frrbies like kitchen trolley,inverter,balcony shade. Lets hope whatever happens for best & may be God has some better deal reserved for me in future.

  63. well VK , I understand seeing what you are going through in finding the right choice of apt for yourself.(The one which you like). And as being said on this blog many times , the one we like and the one that is available , we will see a huge difference in rates. bcoz good apts hold their real value , do not see a great fall and all others — speculation. well with regards to builders charging exorbitant prices , i will advice you to discuss this thought with your fellow collegues who had invested maybe some years back in property when it was booming, all one thought of using banks money to raise their fortunes . That being said , in simple terms it means that being able to see the property prices grow & appreciate @ a min 20% PA to pay bank loans of say 8- 14%. So as per your logic , these fellow people have done nothing so why should they make money. Is that so?? What i am trying to say is this is all business, and all you need simply is good value for your money. a product that would hold its value and is worthy enough to live happyily with a family.gives you comfort and you could call it home. What we are trying to do here is trying to time the market , and that too real estate market . wow no one could ever time the stock market , and then with RE being so diversified , would be able to ever time it. If you are a genuine buyer , all i see is that you have the ability to identify and segregate the speculative market vs Real Solid Stable market. That is all that matters , if reading the past and understanding , i believe many people with logical thinking realized that 2006/07 was overhyped and speculative , and the same people believe currently this is a stable market. Well whether this is the lowest it will be , no one knows , and i am not in predictions but say if you dont get your choice would you ever buy ?? answer is No .. so first see what you want , check whether you can afford it and last try and understand of the stability , project worth of itself….. your e.g. of decorator , you didnt say in which city / area was this….. were there not enough options around. was availibility of an alternative an issue.. what made you to fall prey ?? or was ths some nexus like PBAP ;) This is called , cashing on opportunity well nice way to begin my Monday Morning , cheers guys have loads of fun this week.

  64. Can someone give me details about Kumar Kurti.. by Kumar Builders in Kalyani Nagar. Like builder reputation, location, quality of construction, etc. Surprisingly the quoted rates are not much different from last year Rates quoted in July 2008 were Rs.4800/- Podium floor. Rs.4700/- upto 4th floor. Rs.4750/- 5th & 6th floor. Rs.4900/- 7th & 8th floor. Rs.5000/- 9th & 10th floor. Rates quoted in June 2009 are Rs.5100/- 11th floor. Rs.5200/- 12th floor. I was told there is no availability on lower floors. Possession date quoted in July 2008: June 2009. Possession date quoted in June 2009: December 2009. Anyways I can’t say much expect I cannot afford to buy these flats maybe I never will be able to buy these flats. (I hope one day I will be able to buy) Also, I am not taking a loan to pay for the flats. I don’t want to slog for 15 yrs of my life to sponsor the A,B,C,D,E,F,G,….Z Class Mercs that the builder wants to own and also don’t want to sponsor the 1,2,3,4,5…..n series BMWs that the Bank executives want to own by earning Huge Bonuses for the potential profits earned by the interest we pay. The reason I say the above is because doing some research and information gathering I came to believe (pls correct me if I am wrong) that the cost of development is around 600-800 psf. So potentially the difference in cost in different areas is the Land Cost and maybe some Taxes. Gosh if this is true the profit margins seem huge (maybe I mis-calculated something here. Pls enlighten me if I am wrong). Add to that the fact that I have seen Builders owning huge Bungalows (usually more than 1) n Foreign Cars (again usually more than 1). (Obviously they earn all this with profit margins from selling properties right). Don’t take me wrong I am not getting jealous with the money they have. I am just trying to point out that they do indeed have huge margins when selling flats so they could afford to have those luxuries. But now I hear so many say “Ohh how can we sell in a loss…. Ohh we are nowdays working on wafer thin margins.. Ohh cant reduce the rates anymore otherwise we will be on road”. I believe that a lot of us (human race) have given in to greed. Everyone wants to earn more n more n more at others cost without caring for other in general. An analogy I could draw is….I remember the instance when I was getting married and the Decoration wala was not ready to reduce the cost from Rs. 1 lac for something that would cost him just Rs. 5k in raw material. (Very basic decoration of the stage). He knew he had a monopoly as the hotel would not allow anyone else for decoration. This guy showed us the decoration not in an Album but in a high end Sony Vaio Laptop and left the hotel in a Honda City. I was left thinking even if he would have asked for Rs. 1.8 Lacs who could have stopped him. Maybe 2 yrs down he feels that he needs to own a Honda CRV and so he does charge Rs. 1.8 lacs for the same decoration. God forbid what if he feels like owning a 5 series BMW wonder what will he charge then. Maybe even he could quote ohh “Demand Supply aaisa hi hai kya karen”. (The choice is after all ours but due to various reasons that different parties think (once in a lifetime thing, my youngest sons wedding, my only daughters wedding, my darling sons wedding, will my father be able to see his other grandsons wedding. maybe spend now etc. etc.etc. you give in) Anyways, let me apologize for the long comment. Maybe it is my frustration but I did see the rates going up fantastically fast when so called demand was rising but when the demand has lowered considerably I don’t see the rates coming down as fast…This makes me believe STRONGLY against what most builders say “DEMAND SUPPLY etc. etc etc.”. It is not actually Demand supply dynamics operating here otherwise in today’s times when the demand has lowered considerably the rates would have been much lower as well. Once again sorry for the huge comment.

  65. Satyam to put 7k-10k people on bench with just basic salary and PF. This is like soft lay-off. buying power wil go down with this… What do you feel guys ?

  66. I think Keshav had good knowledge on real estate but he was simply trying to impose his notions on everyone. In fact, it is good that he voluntarily escaped off from the blog. Even I did not like the way he was scrapping. Besides, he never supported his statements with any evidence or logic. Anyway, I am in for HBA but I am in Bangalore. I have forwarded my contact details to Arun and can be contacted for any help required.

  67. Hi All, I find this a very informative blog and it would be nice if in the future too knowledgeable ppl keep on posting their views here. Also please continue to mention which Builders have a good reputation and which projects are good as this is vital information for anyone buying a apartment. Also, the concept of HBA is great but unfortunately I am not in India to participate. Lastly, to Arun, request you to have an option where someone could register to receive updates on the blog without actually having to post a comment (unless I overlooked such an option). To tell the truth I had nothing informative or helpful to mention and commented on the blog just to receive future updates. Once again, thank you all for the information. VK

  68. Good that this numb, insensible and useless guy is off this blog…u better dont dare to comment again…a cheap NUT…good bye forever…. @Sagar, I appreciate u explaining the things to this dumb a**… but to this crap….explicating the things is just next to impossible and would definitely go in vain….so it’s better that we dont have him over here….as it is, his foul comments are never worthy and always seem garbage to me (rather most of them over here)….so let’s kick off this ill-tempered and sick AGENT/BUILDER from here….

  69. @Keshav, I would appreciate if you continue to post your comments here. The only thing I want to say is whatever responses you receive should be replied with seriousness as others reading the comments judge the value of someone’s advice on the way he/she responds back. Remember that even if someone ridicules your advice there are other mute readers who value it if you have sound basis to support. Hope to see your comments frequently. Cheers !! Sagar

  70. Dear Sagar, I’m almost near to post all the facts behind by statement of rising real estate market. I just don’t like any direct posts to me from “WantToInvest”. He is an A**hole. Any polite request would helped instead of starting the sarcastic comment on my statement. I’m off this blog forever. Best of luck! Cheers! KK.

  71. Hello Keshav, It’s a pity that you are behaving in such a way. I’m a person who has purchased a flat in 2007 and do feel that a downward trend in the real estate prices is hurting me. But that should not be the only reason for me to expect that the prices should go up again. I expect that people investing their hard money should get worth its value instead of the builders looting all the hard earned money. The way you are posting comments leaves no doubt in my mind that you either have invested when the prices were at their peak and now want to make people believe that they would jump again…..or you are one of those from the builders who wants to make the members of this blog divert their attention from the fact of getting together to fight against the atrocities of the builders and maintain a reasonable bargaining attitude start believing your baseless advice and fall prey …. I request you to either convey your points with the support of strong facts or assumptions if not keep mum. Mere sarcastic responses would only add to hamper your profile of being nothing but an agent of the builder community …..!!! I hope you understand what I want to convey.

  72. haha. lol. i really enjoy when you go crazy..!! BTW, I pity you as you earn peanuts. You mentioned that you have plenty with you.. so I just thought!! “LOL LOL”

  73. @Keshav, Well…for this sensible answer, you get “PEANUTS” (in CAPS and QUOTES)…thare plenty of such with me…just send a request and you’ll be awarded more nuts…you NUT… i guess amol is correct…u shud be in an IT dept of a builder…By IT dept, i mean PC troubleshooting dept, because u r nowhere near developing a software…leave it …dont worry what software actually means …i’ll let u understand it offline ;-)…now i’m LOL….

  74. Hi Arun, I am already in, but can’t attend meeting as I am out of india. well I got your No. I’ll call you.

  75. That’s good move, Arun. I’m abroad for a while and won’t be able to attend the meeting. However, I would like to be part of HBA. Can you please circulate the agenda and minutes to me as well. Also please provide if you have any number to call (in case you are planning to organise at a place where the phone facility is available). I would urge you to arrange a telecon as well – this will help many people to join on the call. So physical presence is not a constraint. Can we also discuss the plan of building our own neighbourhood in case HBA is not a good option. The prices are gonna go up in choppy trend and builders are aware of it. So we need to play smart now. We have lost the opprtunity to buy in falling market. We should buy at least at optimum level now. Let get united EARLIEST. WE NEED TO MOVE FAST. Thanks! KK.

  76. Arun Prabhudesai

    Appeal to everyone who have commented on this blog I have tried to initiate the HBA now atleast 3 times and except 4-5 no one has shown much interest. Now that market is picking up, it becomes all the more important for all of us, otherwise the story is going to repeat and many will be left high and dry even after a wait for more than 2-3 years. THis is an important movement and all of us need to get together.

      Planning to arrange a informal HBA meeting this Friday or Saturday. Let us know if you are in! you can mail me back admin at trak.in before thursday.

    We will convey you the venue on email IDs.

  77. Folks – A news for you. Real esate prices in India are gonna grow from July’09. Do not expect more fall. There are fundamentals behind this growth. cheers! KK.

    • Keshav can you explain your fundamentals behing the price growth .i know u said u work in IT dept ………but I sincerely suspect if its an IT dept of a builder :P

      • haha. lol.

        • Dont laugh. Support reasons behind your fundamentals…we are keen on hearing how good are you in your basics/fundamentals…and explain by providing some consequential rationale …

        • @WantToInvest – Here’s deal! Wait for 2 months and then you’ll automatically come to know. Howz that? “LOL” – CAPITAL LETTERS and oh ya in quotation marks too! What will I get to provide this justification?

  78. Hi David, I don’t think I am able to make a right prediction and none really! Otherwise, we wouldn’t be reading this blog, would we? :-) I think, we are at the bottom price and it will rise in choppy trend. KK

  79. Thanks Keshav, as government changes and stock market is going up, is there possibility to increas the property rates ?

  80. Guys, One more point of caution. There are few realtors in Pune. They claim to help you in finding good property, getting a best deal, etc. But they are no different than agents, they are white collar real estate agents. Please be careful. Realtor is US concept and Realtor has lot of responsbilities and legal bindings. They have to help you in your interest and not in theirs. There is one very well known realtor in Pune. I don’t want to name is here .. but be careful. I have dealt with them as well and I know how they work. Be careful – everyone is after your hard earned money. Cheers! KK.

  81. Hi David, I am neither an agent, nor work for any builder. I’m also not an investor. During last 4-5 years, I had opportunity to buy 2 assets and I wanted one at Pune-East (Hadapsar area) and other and Pune-West (Wakad side). I have analysed all Pune including the smaller areas and have developed this expertise. I’m very sure that I can advise any of the buddies before buying the flat. I provide the justification so as none needs to trust me blindly. and it’s free of cost! It’s only for buddies! :-) By God’s grace, I’m very well settled in my IT career and not greedy for the first home buyer’s money. I know it’s hard earned money. Sometimes I get irritated with some of the comments at this site as people don’t know how to take benefit of the opporunity. Cheaper flats are not good! You have to pay reasonable price for a good flat. Take my word! I’m settled out of India since a year now, however keeping track of Indian market. I know few estate agents – who want to sell me flats / plots and I know how to understand the facts of that area! :-) I trust none (builder or agent). They all work for money. This blog is really nice to share my knowledge which is helpful to anyone who comes here. Cheers! KK.

  82. Hi Keshav, What is the name of your estate agency ? Are you working for any builder ? If yes then its nice to consult with you before purchasing the flat.

  83. Ashish, which neighbourhood and how much the area? I know lot about Pune, specially Magarpatta. :-) I sincerely appreciate efforts from Arun and other folks here to bring this blog as you see it today. I just sometimes try to add some spice ;-) to increase the TRP. lol Cheers! KK.

    • Jasminiuim – Area – 1490 sqft

      • can u give the breakup of 49lacs? Does it include St duty and Regn? Which floor of Jasmenium? have u seen the flat? i think all Jasmenium flats are ready possession flats. It’s one +ve point here. Check for any leakage. Most imp – check the view. few of the Jasmenium flats are on the extreme boundary of Mgpattta. Think what could be built there ?? I hope no big roads and all, which may cause nuisance to you. So… think ..

  84. hmmm…. interesting.

  85. Magarpatta Guys..this is an exxtraa ordinary blog. Thanks for providing such useful info and special thanks to people like PM, Prakas and Arun. I have been looking for a 3bhk for some time. Would you suggest 2700 psf, 3bhk flat in Magarpatta a good buy. Total cost = 49 Lacs. I am buying it for myself. To add to the posts, I have been surveying the market for last 6 months and the builders have reduced prices in the range of 200-1000 psf. With the +ve news floating around with stock markets, GDP and others… I am bit worried if the these bloody suckers start raising the rates again???

  86. Dear All, Before purchasing any flat/open plot (NA) (or rather any residential property), can any body let me know what all documents/formalities should be exchanged/completed between both the parties (Buyer and Seller)? Pointers to any useful links would be glad to receive. Thanks in advance!

  87. Blindly – go to Park Street, Wakad. I’m not boasting / marketing – but it’s gonna be one of the premium proprty in Wakad vicinity. You won’t repent. I persnally don’t see any further downside. Overall pune, people overestimated demand and there were lot of investors in pune who took the prices to the sky. At current levels I think the prices r reasonable. But it will take smetime for appreciation (the excess stock in the mkt needs to first get absorbed) Indian stock mkts r relatively safe and investable. I think one can start putting money in good frontline based mutual funds. I am again seeing lot of foreign interest and mad rush to invest in indian stocks.

  88. I had visited few projects this weekend in Kharadi.. What surprised me was the confidence (or should i say over-confidence) of these buliders that made them believe that realty prices are again going to soar up once the cabinet is declared and stable govt starts functioning.. This so-called slowdown in realty acc to them is just a matter of a month now… ! What are your views guys?

  89. hey Ritu – you’re right! I missed that area. It’s good area as well. But again – DO NOT GO FOR UNDER CONSTRCUTION. BUY ONLY READY POSSESSION FLATS. Rgds, KK

    • Guys… Pls suggest me some good projects on Baner-Pashan, Wakad and Kondwa areas… I stay towards Kalyaninagar and have no/very little idea about the above mentioned areas.. If any you guys stay around these areas pls mention some good project names… All suggestions are welcome…

  90. Kharadi – I’m not optimistic about that area. Actually there is no reason why Kharadi, etc should come up. They probably are worth Rs. 1000/-, there is major water problem. Check Accolade project, nice project but you need to buy the Bisleri water. Would you do that forever? Since last 2 yrs, ppl living with water problems. It’s known to all. If it’s 30 lacs, then go to Wakad. Omega paradise may be better option. or you’ll find lot of resale flats in that budget. I would like to inform you that – 30 lacs for 2 BHK flat is NOT LESS budget. PLEASE DO NOT SETTLE/ COMPROMISE for less considering you’ve less money. You need to negotiate with sellers. I’m sure, you’ll get it. Go to Wakad or Magarpatta. I belive – Ganga also has good project – it’s in Salunke Vihar. you can try there as well. nice area. it’s ahead of Fatimanagar. YOU WILL SURELY GET NICE FLAT IN 30 LACS. I’m out of India otherwise I would loved to identify the exact location based on your needs. Now, this forum will add another profession to my list – Estate agent / broker, etc. (which I’m not .. lol). I like to help people to get right house. write me at kamat79@gmail.com Cheers! KK

    • Heheh.. Thanks again Keshav… Yes.. I will check out some projects in Wakad. I have heard even on Baner-Pashan road… there r a few good projects that would fit our budget.. Regards, Ritu

  91. Our budget is not more than 30l for a 2BHK (Area arnd -1100). Thus, we have little choice as far as the area is concerned. Can you suggest any good projects that would fit our pockets too?

  92. Thanks Keshav.. What do you think about Kharadi?? The areas you mentioned are currently out of our budget… :(

  93. Guys, can anyone comment on Park Street? I have a flat there. What price should I ask for it? :-) Any comment is warmly welcome! Cheers! KK

  94. I wouldn’t go for Dhanori even at Rs. 1500/- in a palace like structure. According to me, Dhanori is a village and has no significance on Pune map. During such crucial situation, don’t ever think of anything other than Magarpatta, Satara Road, Kalyaninagar, Central Pune like model colony (which is too costly), Koregaon Park, Aundh, max max Wakad. If I were you, I would put money into fixed account and enjoy the “warmth” of the cash. Dont enjoy cash! :-) Just enjoy that feeling. It’s peaceful and pleasure to see your cash growing fast. Thanks, KK.

  95. Hello Guys.. I need some inputs on Dhanori.. I m getting a deal there for 2300 /- for a 2BHK. The project is called Regency Meadows… The construction and finishing is really good and seems to be of very good quality. The layout is also decent enough. But, Dhanori is not quite developed as of now.. and due to the slow down doesnt look like it will start developing well in the near future. Does anybody has any idea about this project and can add something here?

  96. Anything in Kalyaninagar should not exceed Rs. 3, 500/-. Rohan Mithila is the one near airport? I enquired with Rohan’s once day about this and they mentioned that the flats will be made sound-proof to keep the flight nuisance away. Also Boeing has some testing center there? I will not go for Rohan Mithila as airport will cause hell lot of nuisance. PLEASE GO FOR READY POSSESSION FLAT ONLY. where u know what’s pros and cons. Try Brahma, seems they have good projects. Also, you can think of Gera builders. KK.

  97. can anybody guide me on rates in kalyaninabar? i am looking for 2/3 bhk. how abt Fortleza, skylounge or kumat kriti? how abt rohan’s mithila in viman nagar?

  98. Not sure Park Street has got any ready posseision being sold by the builder. You can go to their office and check. They also have Rhythm neighbourhood. Mahindra woods is more beautiful. but seems the maintainace cost is Rs. 3/- psf. not sure.. ! i’m not in touch with latest updates. but u should get a ready possession flat in park street at Rs. 2800/- (i believe it’s reasonable price) – and with total stuff – 2800 * 1100 = around 30 lacs + regn, st. duty, parking, transfer (say max 4 lacs) = 33-34 lacs.

  99. KK, Thanks a lot for you expertise advice. Would really appreciate if you could let me know what will be the negotiable price of park street, mahindra woods in wakad / pimple saudagar.Also plz let me know some good ready possession property with budget @25-28 L RS

  100. @Dheeraj – I have plot in Amar Shrushti, Hadapasar. Recently I have received the offer for Rs. 1400/- psf. WantToInvest is right – I said before I’m investor. But I’ve realised that having plot is worth than having a flat. So not planning to sell, probably will build a house or sell later. But there are no good plots around, I have really hunted for worth properties. Do not buy flats. I would recommend to buy in Magarpatta , if you get ready possesion @2800 + Magarpatta charges , etc. So if you get 1100 sq ft flat in say in less than 35 lacs then worth deal. Try Jasmenium – it’s good. however not all flats are good. one good point about the used flats is – u know leakage, society, ambiance, view, etc. so go for second hand flats these days. Don’t go for under construction. @RS- I did not like DSK Sunderban’s flats, construction and architecture. it’s more like hostel, police quarters. check with Amar Ornate, Flora (next to mgpatta). Be very careful about the sopanbaug area, u will hear trains noise. they will say it’s just 2-3 trains but why to invest? try magarpatta at @2500 (READY CONSTRUCTION) – but again very carfeul abt location. because the front road of magpaata is noisy during midnight due to trucks, etc. it’s the nagar bypass road. if u really ask me – i prefer the western side of pune. Wakad, Pimple Saudagar. I liked Park Street flats a lot. and also the ambience. Akashganga is also goodm but they are sold out. dont go to proper wakad side – like palash, etc. they are good but then surrounded by slums.. So have a look at park street, mahindra woods, u will like them. and they are on the main road – v close to mumbai, uni, hospital.. try negotiating.. once again – i’m not builder and not real investor. i have few assets in pune but don’t want to sell them .. i’m abroad now and doing v well (touch wood) – so money problem is resolved over last 6 months. :-) hope this helps someone.. u may end up paying little extra for a premium flat – take my word. cheap flats will be affordable, but waste. and for some reasons, my taste of residence is little different. i found 75% flats not worth staying. i like calm, beautiful and spcaious flats and still affordable. i bought flat in Wakad with lot of hardships and had trouble in money managmeent. but within 2 years, i’m happy abt my decision. happy exploring… Cheers! KK.

  101. Hi All, I have been reading this interesting and useful blog regularly since last one year. Currently I am planning to buy an 2BHK flat (980sqf) in DSK Sunderban near Amanora of hadapsar. Could you please suggest , what will be the right price of the above property. Shall I buy or wait for some time. I came to know that they are selling 2BHK for 25L. Please share you thoughts in this matter.

  102. Thanks Guys, I appreciate you both for good understandings. Well Keshav just like you I am also out of India and I am still looking for good opportunity to buy some land in Hadapsar my requirement is at least 3000 sq ft., but I couldn’t find anything still in my budget, in fact there is no land nearby, so decided to look around somewhere close to Hadapsar, But coz’ of the volatility I decided to wait, and i think it is a fair decision. I have seen the Rates falling down in that area, all the construction going on in sasane nagar has slashed down the rates, indraprstha society :- rates has also slow down, Amanora :- No booking, Magarpatta :- rates are going down slowly, few of my builder friends from Nagpur, Amravati and Akola all are suggesting not to go for any land or flat purchase till Budget, after budget, picture will be clear and Rates may go down more. It will depend upon the policy of new government. where as builders are looking for some boost up for them according to Times Of India. Coming back to the rescission point if there is not much business for IT and BPO’s in india or if some companies windup from Pune that will create threat in employees of other companies and those people will stop investing in properties, either way it has already came down to 1 to 2%. Regarding NRI investment, those are also not so much interested in buying properties except in there home towns, Everybody wants to hold cash , RBI said that last year NRI deposits ware $300+ M USD and this year it has gone $3000+ M USD, it means everybody have faith on Indian banks, most of NRI’s have transferred there savings to India as also Rupee value have gone down they are all in profit now, so if thay can earn money by simply transfering there money from US account to NRE account why would they invest in property which is not reliable right now. it is simple and logical too. I will still like to wait, and for investors they have to wait for long. again I wish if we could form HBA as soon as possible there are lot of things that we can do by means of HBA it would be an advantage for all.

  103. @Keshav, So that is it. You are lying about NOT BEING AN INVESTOR as you have earlier said in a post that your are an INVESTOR! Keshav said earlier: I am also investor so don’t worry about where I’m working and all. I agree in Pune there is no centralized location as “IT Park”. Pune has got “IT park(s)” :-). Anyways, I would prefer to stay on rent near my office and put my house on rent. From what you have written it is so very clear that you wish to see prices going up for the sake of your investment. We all want that. Lot of us have lost money in the stock market but no one wants to believe that they would now lose in the RE market as well ( In real terms because if 1 rupee today is not 1.1 rupee tomorrow you are losing money). The point I personally am trying to make is that prices are driven by people and builders are cashing on it. Some sensible calculation shows that real ‘loot’ is going on here. There is no justification for the high prices. Things are advertized big time in the name of location, amenities, etc. but it is all plain bullshitting. People are ready to spend 30 lakhs (like Shipra) but what do you get for 30 lakhs today? A small flat in a village where your house cockroach comes to you and says, not enough space for me dude! You can’t even call a decent number of your friends for a party or where there is no space to walk once you have furnished your flat! So why waste this hard earned money knowing that there is no value for it! Why not rent a big house and live like a king. Rentals are FAR CHEAPER in Pune. Of what you have seen that prices have not appreciated since 2007, but it is very clear that they have also gone down considerably! Will it again reach those highs? I don’t think so. What is the driver for that? Driver for the first rise were gullibles in Pune. Now we have run out of them. Who takes on the next rise? I agree with you on your comments about PHURSUNGI. It is a bloody village for God’s sake. And that SP Infocity, I wonder why IBM went there in the first place! Really not livable. Check out Kumar Park Infinias photos on their website. Once you have done that go to PHURSUNGI and check what it is in reality. 44 acres surrounded by slums. No greens anywhere in sight as shown in the photos. Your idea on pooling money and getting it done ourselves is very nice. My Daddy proposed to me that some time back. Infact it is not new and many folks have done it in the city. Let us see if we can pull this DIY through the HBA.

  104. Hey Guys, I was just teasing you folks. Extremely sorry and I apologize for the same. I’m not builder, nor investor. I have bought my assets in Wakad and Hadapsar (which I’ve done long back and I haven’t seen any change in prices from Diwali’ 2007). I belong to Pune and know how the growth is happening. Formation of HBA will give a good start. However, it would unnecessary get into complications where builder will be forced to reduce the rates. Which ultimately will impact quantity. I really wonder why anyone of you haven’t thought of forming a group of say 25 home buyers? With 25*20 lacs = 5 Crore – you can buy a land in good location, build specious flats and have a complete township / society of like minded people. We all need just one good home , right? Banks will give discounts on loans for bulk deals, cements, steel , interiors, all will be discounted. I’ll love to be part of such a nice group with 20 lacs in. Unformtunately, I’m not in India – but if at all we form a society and anyone agrees to plan – i will certainly use my contacts to get best homes for ourselves. Cheers! KK.

  105. Hi Arun and Dheeraj, Thanks for chipping in and letting the self-called Knowledgeable person cum Builder (may be) know the behavioural traits. He just needed that stick to have swung around him. I too give due respect to this blog and the expert comments passed out here. And that is the reason of my participation in the blog. But because of some ppl, the decorum of the blog shouldn’t go haywire. And with this said due respect, I too assure of being modest in my commentary, provided not a single abusive word rebels back. I hope I’m quite clear to the fellow whom I’ve indirectly addressed this. @Arun – Regarding the formation of HBA, I’m IN. Thanks!

  106. Hi All, Darshit is right guys, There may be some people who like to take this blog off the track. I far as I think everybody is welcome to read and put there thoughts on this blog, But some filtration system is necessary to save the blogs reputation I would like to suggest Arun instead of blocking anybody we can filter out the ‘bad words’ and ‘discriminating words/sentences’. @ WantToInvest it is but obvious your reply to Keshav, but why.. because of others you are abusing the words, don’t you think that when we give our valuable suggestions to others what impression it creates in front of them, if we started talking cheap, how can we gain trust. @ Keshav You should also think about it, and if you think that you are so Knowledgeable Person in realty field, then you should share your knowledge with others and guide them in a right way, and as you said PM and WantToInvest are good in calculation, similarly, you can also give some proof for what you say is truth, coz’ when you say something you should have some base to it, so it can be proven to the readers of this blogs. By writing all that you are not only discriminating others but also spoiling the blogs, FOR ME IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU ARE A BUILDER AND DOING ALL THIS TO MISGUIDE OTHERS now you only knows what is the truth. And as far as the question of HBA it may or it may not form, it has nothing to do with this blogs till it exist. If you all show interest in it, I believe we can do it. If any body has any question Regarding HBA they can mail Arun and show there interest. Knowledgeable person will never do loose talk and has a better understanding. it has been said guys ” Talk less then thou you Knowden, Have more then thou you Showden” Guys don’t be discriminating. I hope you all will share your good knowledge with everybody. Help others, Do not let Builders to make fool of house buyers. I hope you all agree with this.

  107. Arun Prabhudesai

    Hey All you guys, I normally do not comment when the discussion is going between 2-3 commenters, infact , I encourage it. However, as a policy, I am requesting all you guys to stay within your limits and only post that will help the readers in some or the other way. Remember, more than 500 people visit this page every day, and the reason is not because of the post, but because of comments from people like you. Now if we start to have internal warfare and use abusive language, it beats the whole purpose. Bottom line is – Henceforth anyone using bad, abusive language – or showing someone else down – will be promptly deleted. Lets have some healthy discussion guys !!!

  108. What is this childishness going on , I have subscribed to this blog to view healthy debates about Real Estate and not to hear personal ego tantrums / between couple of folks. Its a blog , all will try and be an expert , but there are ample comments for the viewers to have a better understanding. But lets keep the basic premise of RE awareness alive , rather than childish comments.. It is helping no one here… Hope you all understand.

  109. @Keshav, I guess ur over-frustrated by my teasers… hahahaha teri to chud gayi lagta hai… go visit a psycholgist…u really need one… and hello….pls dont mislead ppl by ur neophytic comments. they dont even make a beginner’s sense… sorry to say…..but ur a total foolish…i beg the organization where you work (i don’t know whether you have a job or not :-D)…please kick off this imprudent, idiotic and a thoughtless guy….this is the best time to lay him off…he doesn’t even deserve a housekeeper’s job… aur jara apne mata-pita se sanskar seekh kar aao…if you are unaware of the communication etiquettes, then go and attend an english writing + speaking skills program…. buddy…..u badly need holistic improvements…that’s wat i hav to say abt u…. @Arun – request you to pls block this guy… Regardless and Thankless….

  110. @Arun – Can you please start a new blog where the blogs can be written by some knowledgeable persons? We can avoid PM, WantToInvest like immature folks who are fooling around? They both seems are good at mathematics. But they need fundamental real estate knowledge as well. They can be good matematics teachers in primary school. I request the bloggers to find a good job for them so that they can stop wasting our time on this blog. KK.

  111. @WantToInvest – I really laughig out loudly. The reason is – “You really don’t know anything about Pune and still act like an expert”, accept the fact. Seems you stay somewhere near Magarpatta and have developed such mentality. @Sipra – If you’re planning to buy then buy in Pimple Saudagar than Kharadi, Fursungi, etc. The reason is – Fursungi has no value as there is only IT park (SP Infocity – where IBM has main presence) and it’s worst locality to stay. If you’re planning to buy in Kharadi or Fursungi area, then buy only and only as Magarpatta City. The advantage of Pimple Saudagar – mainly Pimple Saudgar is populated area in that vicinity. Wakad, Pimple Nilakh, etc are not good to stay. Aundh is expensive and very crowded so not worth. Pimple Saudagar has taken good shape and if you can get a “ready possession” flat @ 2500 to @2700 – i think it’s worth buy. But please DO NOT BUY UNDER CONSTRUCTION flats as none knows when builder will complete the construction. Now if you talk about the cost – the ready possession flats are with the investors who would certainly like to wait for good price. Pimple Saudagar is closest to Mumbai – it’s hardly 2 hours drive to Thane and Navi Mumbai. Lot of folks from Mumbai like to stay there so the area is well developed. Builders don’t hold any ready possession flat and if they have any – those are not of good quality. So, forget everything – if you liked the flat and it’s reasonable rate – go and buy it. couple of lacs will come later but a flat worth of our choice is important. Fursungi, kharadi, vimannagar have water problems wherewas Pimple Saudagar has PCMC control and it’s well maintained. Also roads are widening up. It’s certinaly a good choice. I know GK builders have good reputation but they did not have good flats. Sun Crest is on that corner of Happy Thoughts ashram? It’s good area … but again please think over. that the main nasik road (140 mtr) wide. so don’t go for front facing. Go for inside flats. And please let me know before yo purchase. I read this blog and this blog will bring nothing but just talks. HBA won’t be functional for another 2 years. this fistful of talkers can’t change the Pune’s real estate. They all miss the basic fundamental knowledge. Anyways, i enjoy reading their immature comments. Best luck! dont get carried away. Cheers! KK.

  112. Hi Shipra, Along with Pimple Saudagar, there are many such areas where you could get a flat at your mentioned price, like, Phursungi, Kharadi etc. I mean the suburbs. Please do a research on the ‘psf’ rates in various locales. You can seek help from leading realty websites like for 99acres.com or magicbricks.com and create an inventory of rates in respective areas. With the help of such web locations, you’ll be able to do a self-survey. Additionally you’ll get inputs from this thread. Both these things will collectively help you get closer to a firm decision. Don’t fall prey to fancy ads in the newspapers or any other media. According to many of the property analysts, it would be wise to wait for some time. The deadlock between sellers and buyers is definitely gonna benefit the buyers, since, to resolve this deadlock, the sellers will be forced to cut down their rates. Regards.

  113. Hi! I am looking for a 2bhk flat in pune ,my budget is 25 -30 lakh max.,plz suggest what to do shall I wait or proceed .I have seen some flats in Pimple Saudagar coz that’s d only area in pune where I can get a flat in this budget .And any body has an idea about Malpani builder (The Crest) and Sidhivinayak builder ,Their quality of construction and after sale support.Plz suggest ,I am new to this thread ,today just by chance I got to read this ,ur doing a gd job of guiding d people and their hard earned money through this thread.

  114. So cheap of you to talk like that @Keshav. I have considered an average rate of 400-600 psf and that INCLUDES everything and all rises/increases, etc. Since you asked, let me provide you some data. Cost of steel in 2003 per MT (metric tonne) was ~ 25K (what did flats cost 700psf?) Cost of steel in 2009 per MT (metric tonne) is ~ 30K (what do flats cost 3000psf!!!) <> 20% up in 6 years, which a very very crude conservative calc shows to be ~3% per annum which is less than inflation! How can this meagre inflationary increase contribute to absurd property rates! A 1200 sq.feet built up area 2BHK is fairly priced at 20 Lakhs today. psf rate should be around 1300 psf. Anything over this is naked loot by the builder as I have demonstrated. It is no doubt that people are still buying at higher rates and will buy at these absurd rates with gullible folks like @Keshav around :) and then justify their ‘intelligent’ purchase :) BEWARE, builders in Pune today are selling 2BHKs like 700-800sq feet in 20 lakhs. This again is a marketing tactic. DO NOT FALL FOR IT. This sized flats should cost like 12 lakhs in good locality (A fair value). Defining FAIR – Good business for builder and good prices for home buyers. @Dheeraj, I am in for HBA.

  115. Hi all, Just one thing…… What is happening with HBA is anybody seriously interested in it or not please be clear. If we want to do it we can really make it happen, but when it is time for implementation, nobody is showing interest, that’s a crap. Arun is there any way that we can go ahead and form HBA with the people who has shown interest, instead of waiting for some more to join us?

  116. @Keshav, By the Way….Are you Arun’s father-in-law? I don’t understand the stupid reason why are you so concerned about our discussion… Arun replied back to me in a decent way and even I did it the same way the second time. So, the matter was solved and he’s trying to get back my post (which was thoughtfully written…not as rogue as yours…) Don’t get excited, over-react un-necessarily and burn your ass…Neither Arun did it nor I (in my second reply)… so shut your mouth and let things take their way… happy blogging :)

  117. @PM, You are really khajoor. Steel cost is increased, labour cost increased, all increased buddy. Is it gonna be borne by your daddy? Don’t misunderstand but you should be sensible while calculation. @WantoToInvest, Who the hell you’re to write nonsense stuff to Arun? Arun has been doing wonderful job and none of the comments have been deliberately deleted. You first should apologize to Arun. He has big heart that he posted your scoldings to him on his blog. None invited to come and shit on this blog. You should respect the blog and the author of this blog. KK.

  118. Can anyone deny what I am saying. If you plan to build a bungalow for yourself, 400 – 600 psf is what should be budgeted as cost of construction (Consultation, Labour & Material). The variation is for what quality you go for. 600 => Premium construction. Here is something I did to tickle myself – Builder purchases 100 gunthas of land for a project of 2 buildings, 100 flats each. A society is built on 100 gunthas (1 guntha = 1000 sq feet) of land having 200 flats. The land was purchased for 10 lakhs a guntha (1000 rupees per sq feet with registration)! => 10 crores. Builder divides the cost of land among 200 flats, so each flat owner pays 5 lakhs as part of cost of land in this NICE AREA. Each 2 BHK (of 1200 sq feet) here premium construction costs builder 600 psf. So cost of construction = 1200 * 600 = 7.2 lakhs. Total cost for 2 BHK of size 1200 sq feet = 13.2 lakhs Money spent on approvals and amenities by builder on this project happens to be 4 crores. He splits and adds this up in the flat’s price (2 lakh per head). So cost of flat = 15.2 lakhs (~ 15 lakhs). Good location and and premium construction. Now builder is doing business, so he obviously wants atleast 30% profit (10% to bank deta hai yaar. Equities give 15-20% averaged). So cost of flat that builder is selling comes to 20 lakhs. Premium construction with all amenities. With a 100% profit margin he would sell it for 30 lakhs and that is exactly what is happening today. 1200 sq feet sized flats cost somewhere around this price if sold for @2200 psf (Advertized as low price!!! – 100% profit margin is low price in Pune!). If builder is charging even more then imagine what kind of profit he is making! Going by regular trend that you pay around 3-4 lakhs more than psf price of flat, this flat should be FAIRLY advertized at 16 lakhs/1200 = 1300 rupees psf with decent profit to builder. Things actually sold for 900-1100 psf few years back in this city and 1300-1500 today sounds reasonable to me considering rising land prices and inflation and other bullshit. The fact is that it is really not the RAW COST of making a flat that has gone up (Although all builders keep saying that), it is the profit margin the builders are making. More than 150-200% in some instances. This is what needs to come down. Some more facts to tickle you: Cement was 130 per 50 kgs in 2006 (Approx) 210 per 50 kg in 2008 (Approx) Price rise = 50% Cement cost is less that 5% of the total construction cost, so this increase should only have an increase in 2.5% of the cost of a flat!

  119. @Arun, @WantToInvest, Seems the posts were LOST IN MAINTENANCE :) Not an issue. I more or less wrote the same thing in my earlier post which got dropped.

  120. Hi Arun, Thanks for your revert. FYI…even the comment of user “PM” has got deleted. I wasn’t aware of the maintenance activity out here. Anyways, please try and restore it, as I solicit some more replies on my comment. Thanks!

  121. Arun Prabhudesai

    Hi WantToInvest, I have not deleted any of the comments or posts, Ask any of 300 commenter’s, and you will know that. However, if you see my latest posts – last 2 days, we were carrying out certain upgradations, and you comment may have been lost during Migration – however, do not worry, I I will try and restore it as soon as possible. I encourage comments on this blog, whether positive or negative – and have never deleted any comment till date – please be rest assured about that.

  122. @PM, Even I had replied back to you with a detailed post! Who the hell deleted my post???????????? If the job of this website’s administrator here is only to sit and delete the posts, then why the shit has he opened the blog for all???? Let him alone have the discussion. I want my post back….this is a non-sense blog…..

  123. @Vikas, that regular price rise is called inflation and should be anyway expected. What justifies 300% rise in 3 years in this city? Do you think Pune was more livable 5 years back or is more livable now?

  124. @WanttoInvest. Had written a detailed post earlier. It did not make through for some reason :( Anyway, Things like the airport, etc. is all bullshit. This has been going on since over 6-7 years now for Chakan. Even if the airport is made which carriers are going to come and who is going to fly from there? Does Mumbai’s International airport which is not very far off have any issues? Can it not handle the ‘International’ traffic at present that we need another International airport within 150 kms! Proposed airport at Chakan makes no sense to me other than having a political agenda. About these manufacturing companies being around, they would have loads of workers and workers do not get the obscene salaries that IT professionals have seen in the past. I agree with the fact stated earlier that new levels would be set for IT industries also because of reduced billing rates, over availability of graduates, China & Latin America competition and recession. Pune too is not going to grow as it did in the past. It may see negative growth with companies opting out because of increased operational costs. I do not see an iota of increase in your investment today in Chakan over 5 years. This is my personal opinion. Please feel free to research before plunging into the deal.

  125. According to Freddie Mac, U.S. home prices have climbed 6.2% a year over the past 30 years. Numbers are similar if data is seen for the Indian market – however no single index is available in India to make such a confident statement in Indian conditions.

  126. According to Freddie Mac, “U.S. home prices have climbed 6.2% a year over the past 30 years. ” Numbers are similar if data is seen for the Indian market – however no single index is available in India to make such a confident statement in Indian conditions.

  127. Hi PM, It’s nice to read your sensible and thought comments on the property dimension in Pune. I’m planning to invest 10-12 lacs for a flat in Chakan, Pune. Albeit, having read your comments, it seems that you are not in favour for an investment in Chakan. However, looking at the big automobile shots aroung Chakan (Wolksvagen, Mercedes), the proposed International Airport etc., would a property in this area can lead to a better investment? Your thoughts please!

  128. Right. @Keshav talk of what you pay back. The property will never be worth that much so its a lose scenario. Also what is the guarantee that Pune will keep growing and all these fancy IT companies will stick around for long with increasing operating costs! We are buying flats to stay in them, not to let. Does Pune or your job guarantee that you would be here the next year? What is the urgency to buy now? Are we short of cheap rental places in and all around Pune? Hold on to your cash. You never know what is coming up tomorrow. The market is very dynamic. Governments are saying things but companies are still collapsing. Stock market is all satte-baazi (gambling). Its 300 points up and then 300 points down. Think like this, the builder makes profit because of the 300 points up and since you invested at that high level, you lose 300 points the next day because things were all made up by this smart lot. Also its not the absolute amount here, it is what you are getting for the money. There was this 2 BHK furnished Ad in TOI for 12 lakhs. Well it is in Chakan! I tell you, you can get a Bungalow for around 11 lakhs in Bhopal. Would you like to do that? Also see how these builders are playing smart and building these new 2 BHKs as small as 600 square feet and proudly announcing it at lower rates :( I have a feeling that again they will be in shit because no one wants a 2BHK less than 850 sq feet. Which sensible person is going to buy pygmy 2 BHKs. The rooms won’t even fit a folding cot let alone a queen size bed :( And they are going all around saying that people PREFER COMPACT HOMES these days! Who the f*** said that? I don’t want to live in a Servant quarter! Instead of all this, why not rent a good spacious 3BHK very cheap and live like a king. There are tons of such flats on rent in any area you name in Pune. Hold on till you really find something where your heart says – This is value for money. Till then happy timepass reading all those hoardings and newspaper ads by the builders :) day after day and feeling good.

  129. Hi All, How is everybody? well I agree with you Kiran it will take long 2+ years for recovery, but there may be some permanent damage to Indian economy, Like BPO’s if BPO industry wont take proper steps then US and UK already have other option like China some other country may also come up with very low labor cost, so ultimately ppl working in these kind of industries are going to get less salaries which will not allow them to buy such a costly flats. As Keshav said about decent flat, I would like to suggest him to wait and watch what happens, 35L will soon turn into 27 to 30L, if not then the whole project will held up, or will take at least 3 years for complete booking. 35L is unaffordable for the majority ppl who are employees, so forget about it. Though even last month was good for the share market but it has brought bad news for Job holders, alone in Last month ( April 2009) 534,000 people lost there job in US, now this is also going to affect IT and BPO’s in India, US has also announced that every US citizen should complete there Graduation and the government is going to provide them facilities to complete it, it means that NRI’s H1B1 holders will have lot of struggle and most are going to loose there jobs in 2010 end. people are ready to work for $ 3000 USD in US inspite of high Taxes. In coming months NRI investment in Realty will reduce drastically. Also the rate of flat booking cancellation will increase then the present. In my previous comments I already said that this rescission is going to set New Salary Standards which will be lower then 2007-08 in most kind of common Job’s. For now no matter what these builders says but what is heading up they knew it very well. so for to sell there current projects and to save them self from bearing loss they are spreading the rummer in market, For me it is no more different then a beautiful women looking for men or trying to attract men. I would just suggest you all guys… “Stay Away From AIDS”. What I mean is ultimately somebody is going to bear loss and these builders are trying to put that burden/loss on the house buyers,…. guys just play smart; even if you all don’t believe us, you can use your own logic and think about that the prices are coming down and they are not going to rise up so soon so you have lot of time to see the bottom. Think about all this you all can still wait for to buy your dream home. I still say wait for the right time to come, it has not arrived yet, if you wait it is for sure oyu won’t face loss at all. Our aim is to just help all, it is not intense to discriminate anybody, it helps all of us to think from all points of view before we all opt to give all of our hard earned money to the hart less builders. Keshav please don’t mind it but think on it, today it looks 35L but when you pay back it almost goes 60+L for the general house buyer (Loan+ interest for 15 to 20 years)

  130. @Yogesh – My observation – the 6 flats are odd flats and none buying them. Even builder reduces the price, none would like to buy nonsense construction. For premium flats, you need to pay reasonably good cost even in today’s market. This blog is good but lot of people have wrong perspection. Builders are not fool. You can’t buy good flat below 2500 in an under construction building. So 1000 sq ft = 25 lacs + other charges. So for a 2 BHK decent qukaity flat, 35 lacs is the right prices. Best luck. let me know which flat u have seen. Try park street – they have goot nice flats.

  131. Friends, The economy is now badly affected. Many guys have lost jobs and soon to come. Expert says that it will take 2.5 yrs to recover the situation. So its better to hold the cash. Please don’t buy flat. Even if flat’s rate goes down, there is no assurance of future income. These builders will not have any option than selling flats in low rate/loss!!! Many construction sites are now on hold and those which are ready possesion are getting older. Be wise and save yourself. Kiran More

  132. hi guys … I am reading this blog from last few days. I am tryind to buy a 2BHK in Pune from last 1 year but property rates are too high.and we cant even think of buying a flat in city. we have to look 20 / 30 km out of city and that means daily travel of 20 / 30 KM oneway in pune’s traffic. these builders are not ready to bring property rates down .. the difference noticed is the rates r down by 200/300 PSF only… and now builders are ready to negiociate… but how much can one even negiociate for 2 BHK of 45 / 48L ???????????? we cant bring it 25/28L ………………… i agree that same adds are displayed in paper from last 6 months (only 6 falts are available) this add from last 6 months .. means they have not sold even 6 flats in 6 months ………but still not ready to reduce prices ??????????????????????

  133. Arun Prabhudesai

    ALL, I have sent mail to more than 30 mails for 1st meeting of HBA, only 2-3 have got back to me. Guys, you ALL HAVE TO SHOW INTEREST to take this forward. Please reply to the mail I have sent you so that I can fix up a time to meet. I am looking at meeting tomorrow evening. PLEASE REPLY. Call me on the number given on my twitter profile http://twitter.com/trakin .


  135. Thanks Darshit for your honest comments. What I mean here is not from any consultant or analyst but try to through light on what facts look like and what exactly we should be looking at & analyse what steps we need to take instead of the larger lot following analysts etc…. This is to our benefit. However, analysis that are presented to us through various media can be taken as a clue and can be analysed further on our own strengths and sense of judgement. No need to follow them blindly. READ THIS LINK AND PLEASEEEEEEE “”HANG ON”” – DON’T BUY – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/property-prices/further-correction-of-20-25-expected-in-property-prices.html#more-2547 & also read other links mentioned on your right hand side of the above web-link page.

  136. Lets also make sure not to invite unncessary people like, so called ‘great real estate blogger’ of the great pune city who does nothing but to misguide people by praising all and any builders and projects in city and in surrounding villages…

  137. Arun Prabhudesai

    I have sent mails to all the people interested in HBA. We have around 7-8 of them. We need more participation.Get your friends to join. Send mails if interested…First meeting tentatively planned for this weekend.

  138. Arun Prabhudesai

    PM, David, Darshit and all interested in HBA. I am actually surprised that you guys are saying, I had requested for the meeting and no one replied. I am more than happy to meet up and discuss this. Infact lets do it on this weekend. and I am not going to rely on emails anymore. Go to http://twitter.com/trakin and call me on my mobile so that we can set this up on priority basis. (I am not putting my mobile number here for spam purposes) Also, I have created a Twitter ID http://twitter.com/punehba , follow all the notifications from there. Now lets all of us get moving….SHow us some great participation.

  139. Guys, let us at-least meet. Arun, what happened? For giving advice – There is no problem. Only expecting the others to take is not wise. When you give an advice you have a strong reason to believe in what you are preaching … unless of-course you are fooling someone.

  140. I am also NOT interested in HBA. Sorry! I don’t want to attract unnecessary trouble. Best Luck.!

  141. I think Arun bhai not intrested forming HBA…. Prakash, PM can we go for this ?

  142. Discussion Point

    Hello! You have learned the most important lesson about giving an advice. You have also told it very well. Now, i have become wise. I will not give an advice and make a fool of myself. Kidding. Good post. Thanks!

  143. well Prakash , Actually i must say , i can not deny but agree to you. Infact what you have said makes sense…. Link – chain ripple effects , and you see and predict a dooms day ahead for indian economy and indian middle class — well i believe in all you said and all your economics made sense but the world has always and will always keep defying the theory and logic theory leading to any economic analyst . When the boom defied any logical thought as would be agreed by anyone , the fall is similar with there being more negativity and fear , caution leading to feel like a more severe recession than it really is. There is no problems in playing and living safe but doing this we become conservative and anything then requires more time to come out of it. This is not my comment contradicting your thought about further inevitable fall , but it says & believes things are near bottom and sees stability and some sanity to return to indian markets in general , base – for 2/3 years before +++. As i said earlier , i can in noways defy your economic theory but you never know …. as Analysts only see -ve then things go wrong and talk about growth when they go up…. they always make people cry bcoz when people believe them either they end up spending which is way beyond their comfort level or restrict spending even when they could ?? so i never believe them and for me my ability to buy / spend is totally based on my affordibility factor.(this factor was stretched way beyond in 2006-2007 by folks like us believe the theory of growtha nd only growth and hence compromised and paying price for fall now) If i can afford and if the price is legitimate , its buy time and if both dont match , then hold on and dont follow any theory… being more conservative , will never grow money …. well , lets wait for coming months , again the Mantra is Diwali – 09… I am interested in following this trend not just property but overall and lets see how big we Indians and India is impacted …

  144. Hi Guys, Yeah you are right, they are desperate and a lot needs to be unturned….. What I rightly call it as “”DISTRESS SALE””. This will happen in next 3-4 months. We all have to just HANG ON, that’s all. Yeah again you are right, if BJP comes to power at the least there is hope of revival else, its already in dumps and No Not At All the Commie 3rd Front……please save us all from this joke. Cong has looted India until date and will do so…. there’s no end to it….. HA! HA! HA! HA! CONG calls BJP Communal Party – come on JOKE OF THE MILLENIUM !!!! Its this CONG which started the MAJORITY & MINORITY FUNDA which itself is SO MUCH COMMUNAL then further it started the RESERVATION FUNDA which is clearly based on COMMUNAL AGENDA – What more one need. At the least BJP is talks of Hindutva which is mass of all hindu casts & creed. It talks of Uniform Civil Code to neutralize the Hazardous CONG creation of Muslim Vote Bank etc…. etc….

  145. In today’s Timepass Of India. Magarpatta City advertizes – front page. Oh Baby, it is getting too desperate. for those who stay close by would know how it started with these new Magarpatta projects: [1] No advertisement – People will beg for a booking [2] Big hoardings outside Magarpatta City – Hey guys we are open for bookings [3] Small hoardings in the main road driveway advertizing SPECIAL INTEREST RATES. See the interest rates have come down which means more affordable homes :) [4] Casual Advert in TOI few weeks back [5] Front page Ad in the name of Akshaye Tritya … and do you know who is paying for that Advert? :) How desperate!

  146. Property up in 10 years is again pure speculation. There are plots of lands and built up deteriorating properties (not in Pune) offered at less than what they costed 7 years back! If a politician decides to make an International School close-by then things may change, but that again is wishful thinking. To what I know, many village properties (like the ones in Pune – the most recent being Dhanori) are sold with this mis-information. Who the F*** is going to stay there? And why are we all ASSUMING that Pune will only grow? Can’t it shrink? Pune is a damn expensive place today. More expensive that the capital on India! Why would companies want to come here when other cities offer much less operational costs. Reducing operational costs is point number zero on all organizations list. They are doing this by layoffs, removing perks, reducing salaries and shifting offices. Focus on >>Shifting Offices<<. I know of even small offices being shifted from city centers to Pune outskirts. Not much time when they would not be anywhere near Pune. All this just needs a smart chief minister of a state to click. Gujarat is close by and I think it would witness a lot of exodus chiefly from Maharashtra. Anyone disagrees?

  147. Prakash, what you have written I agree with totally. There is just one thing you have to realise. Lowering of interest rates by US and India is going to screw us once more. It will cause inflation, making our currency worthless. The effect will be – what ever we have saved will lose in value relentlessly. And prices of real estate will move up. Not now, but 10 years from now, everybody owning a flat will be glad they bought. So if you have money sitting in the bank and there is something you need to buy – a house, car, vacation, house repairs, ANYTHING – better use your Rupee while it still has value. As for retired people – they wil be finished. Better bet on a BJP victory. They will be least inflationary. Congress has always caused inflation. But pray that the Commie 3rd front doesnt come to power – they will cause stag-hyper-inflation, totally finishing off India. Which is what the communist’s Chinese masters want to achieve. Venkat

  148. Addition to Point No. 2 : [1] Movies – at decent theaters costed only Rs.40-50 now with MUCH LESS SPACE it costs Rs.150-200 [2] Restaurants – earlier cost was Rs.70-80 for 2 persons now its Rs.120-140 for 2. [3] Monthly home expences earlier was Rs.4000 now its Rs.7000 HEY HERE MORE INFO TO SUPPORT MY 13th APRIL POST POINT NO. 1 – Reproduced below – 1. Global surprises are still hidden. US problems will resurface afresh with new artifacts which our normal eyes fail to see. This is Fiscal Deficit of over US $ 1.1 Trillion and each passing day is just adding to this deficit. US will not be able to come out of it as it has been perceived. Unemployment is at its peak and we will soon see new peaks being attained. Europe is lackluster for entire FY’09 & FY’10. Thus there is very little chance that economy will be robust anytime before FY’11. Read this Link for more Hidden Surprises from US – http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/News/International-Business/3-more-US-banks-fail-lifting-this-years-tally-to-28/articleshow/4446882.cms IN TOTALITY NO. OF BANKS FAILED WORKS OUT TO : 56 Yet there is no bottom, with Huge Deficit of US and equally Growing Fiscal Deficit of India which is of GREAT CONCERN the situation will grow grim.

  149. Dear Darshit, Thanks for taking your valuable time to NOT UNDERSTAND the ROOT CAUSE. I still suggest DO ROOT CAUSE ANALYSIS – For all that you have written in reply analysis I stongly feel that you will find all your ANSWERS to your QUESTIONS in my post, point no. 2 reproduced below – ITS THE REAL GURU MANTRA FOR YOU & ALL – ============ 2. Asian economies are stable only due to Exports to US & European markets. Thus, stimulus plans of China & Japan will just dry off in couple of months and will not assist in reviving the economy. Gone are the days where domestic growth supported the GDP. This view held by many analysts is actually vague since they fail to realise that domestic growth was in a way trigered by Free Flow of Credits and economy boost posed by their respective exports. This money was getting circulated within the country making it to feel as if the economy was growing internally. If this was the case then Indian & China should have retained respective growth rates of 9% & 12% irrespective of collapse of global economy. What I mean to say is – When the root dries, the tree normally dry a bit later & that’s the ground reality. =============== To Understand this GURU MANTRA one needs to understand the Cyclic Order of this Generation of Easy Credit & Perishing of this Money. Here is this explanation – [1] Just introspect and understand the intricate cyclical order of rotation of easy credit money, its misuse, its artificial nature, its a big blown ballon, how it made Govt. and general public believe that India is Growing @ 9% or China is Growing @ 12% [2] General public was made to believe that there is growth because of – (a) Origin of Easy Free Flow of Huge Credits starts from US & Europe. This is the ROOT CAUSE & A HOAX if one really understands it, remember (b) That Easy Credit Money is used to boost exports generating higher revenue, resulting in rotation of the same easy credit money. (c) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money results in building luxurious infrastructure, (d) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money results in increase of salaries by just 30-40%, (e) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money results in increase of commodity price by 50%, (f) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money results in increase of Property prices by 400%-500%, (g) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money results in increase of Hotels, Restaurants, Malls, Luxury or High End Versions made available at your door-steps in consumer goods or vehicles (cars etc) or education packages or tours & travels etc…. etc….. (h) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money that had increased individual income by 30%-40% year-on-year & was successfully SIPHONED OFF because the money people earned was re-circulated in the system by way of higher spending & WHOM DID THIS EASY MONEY ULTIMATELY REACH – ITS INDIAN BANKS & FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS & WHOM DID THIS EASY MONEY INDIAN BANKS ULTIMATE PAY TO ITS BANKS & FINANCIAL INSTITUTIONS IN US & EUROPE, NOW AGAIN THE SAME US & EUROPE BANKS & INSTITUTIONS CREAMED THE PROFITS OF THIS MILK & RECIRCULATED THE TONED MILK BACK INTO THE SYSTEM, HOW DID THIS HAPPEN, IT WAS BY – buying of property at higher price thus paying nearly 25K – 40K as EMI to Banks, purchase of consumer goods-white goods on EMI’s, high rate of spending by purchases in Malls, spending for purchase of Vehicles like Cars on EMI etc…. etc…. (i) Rotation of this Easy Credit Money makes every one believe that Economy is Growing because of the above points. Companies believe as they are getting Easy Credit Money to circulate, this Easy Money is generating Export Business for US & EUROPE & the place where this easy credit money originates, Industry & Infrastructure believes economy is growing & they start building amenities, infrastructure etc…. with the same Easy Credit Money and they ensure that the so called growth in income is Siphoned Off . (j) For you who’s earnings increased from meager 15K to sudden 40K-70K, the effective rise of 25K – 65K never went to your bank account or saving or one NEVER BECAME A MILLIONAIR because of – Property Prices Increase by 400%-500% thus your House EMI itself is 25K – 40K, one spends in purcase of Car so another 7K-10K as EMI, one spends in Malls-High End Hotels-Restaurants-Tours & Travels another 10K Monthly, Spends in purchase of White Goods-Consumer Electronics at higher prices so another 10K-12K of EMI or draining of cash. EFFECTIVELY WHAT LANDS IN YOUR LAP AT THE END OF THE MONTH IS JUST 10K-15K WHICH ONE NEEDS FOR – Groceries, Education, Local Commuting, Electricity Bills, Internet Bills, Milk Bill, News Paper Bill, TV Cable Bill, etc….. etc…… WHAT EXACTLY FINDS IN YOUR ACCOUNT AT THE END OF THE MONTH IS JUST …. JUST 3K-5K AS ULTIMATE SAVING. This saving one needs to spend in buying Life Insurance or Bonds or PPF etc….. to save Tax. HA! HA! HA! HA! —– You Common Man You Are Finished —- This way. [3] Suddenly this Easy Credit Money Stops, thus stopping the Circulation, resulting in Stoppage of following – (a) Company finds it difficult to get US & EUROPE BUSINESS (b) Indian Banks find difficult to get US & EUROPE Easy Credit Money (c) Companies start taking strict actions – Lay-Offs, Cut in Salary, Cut in Amenities, No Increments, Cost Cutting to Survive coz they have got used to it by now….. (d) Industry starts feeling the pinch, as Exports to US & EUROPE START DROPPING, resulting in big difference in Supply & Demand Scenario (e) Employees or People spending comes to hault due to uncertain conditions, purchases stops, extra spending stops, (f) All Suddenly Starts to STOP the BUZZ, the THRILL, the GROWTH, EXCEPT HA! HA! HA! HA! – Yeah you got it PBAP & LUSTY BUILDERS. (g) Growth Falls from 9% to below 5%, China Growth drops from 12% to ~8%. [4] So my dear friend & friends this is the ULTIMATE CYCLE & GURU MANTRA. If India & China were Growing it was bacause it was back riding the HOAX, ARTIFICIAL EASY CREDIT MONEY. If India & China were really Growing because of so called Robust Domestic Demand etc…. then irrespective of all this they should have sustained not 9% & 12% but at least 8.5% & 11.5% something. BUT NO THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN. [5] We the so called Business Analysts, Business Guru’s etc…. fail to understand the VAGUE NATURE of this Growth & Fall. [6] PBAP & BUILDERS Refusing to accept this are the real Culprits, LOOTERS, BASTARDS…… your income growth of 30%-40% resulted in Property Price Growth of 400%-500%. You the People were Equally responsible for it since one never realised that this is result of Easy Credit Money Circulating in the System, no doubt for you it was your hard ended money unlike industry biggies. [7] US & EUROPE – CORRECT THEMSELVES TO YEAR-2000 LEVEL ALMOST, all prices come back to Year-2000 level. India rest of the lot starts coming back to Year-2004 level where it all started e.g. Bank Interst Rates BUT PBAP & BUILDERS NOOOOOO WAYYYYYYYY I HOPE THE “” GURU MANTRA “” AND THE EPICENTER OF ALL ACTIVITIES IS NOW CLEAR. THINK OF YOU, THINK OF YOUR CHILDREN, THINK OF YOUR FAMILY, WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO GIVE THEM…… DON’T BUY NOW, SAVE YOURSELF, SAVE OTHERS……. Thanks Prakash

  150. Darshit/Prakash/All, Nice discussion. @HK, TOI acronym was nice. @David, I can write an article. Not a problem. I first want this HBA to be setup. Arun bhai, where are you and what happened to our meet? Since I do not read this everyday, please schedule something not before 2 weeks which gives me ample time to come back to this article. I have put my thoughts for some of Darshit’s questions/reasoning below: Why were people still buying in 05/06/07? >> Because of the greater fools theory :) Why have they stopped buying now? >> Because we have found the biggest fool :) … You can still find them if the greatest fool is ready to sell at 20% or 40% or 60% of their purchase price or else this biggest fool keeps the crown. Why did people not crib when rates were increasing in past years? [1] The flats still seemed affordable to them [2] Because they felt that the amenities provided were for real :) which they do not now :) [3] Because they thought their ceilings would not leak and their walls would not crack which they still do. [4] Because they thought, it’s different this time :) Does a fresher join at 2004 level or 2008 level? >> They do join at 2008 level but 2008 level is 30-40% higher than 2004 level attributed to inflation and industry (IT) growth. So we are not talking 300% rise in their pay package to afford a house at present rates! Onsite folks lost jobs or jobs shifted to India will create more demand >> Possibly these people will stay in ONE OF THE flats they already possess. I do not know any Pune person staying abroad not having a flat in Pune. So no fresh buying because of this. More people in Mumbai taken to cars >> The public transport is expensive! In Pune, traveling by auto-rikshaw is 3 times as expensive as traveling in a luxury petrol car giving an average of 10 kms/liter. Fine dining not in 2004 >> Another place to spend EASY money. Also attributed to the fact that every person dining there pays for their own food – Like working couples or would be working couples. Still un-affordable for single earning folks. The bigger social change because of this (working couples) is yet to be seen in India. Desire for a 25 year old .. >> Will die soon. Attributed to EASY money. 15K for a 12th grader who can’t add 2+2! BPO salaries to reduce by 50% in the coming year. So possibly one now needs 3-4 girlfriends or wives to buy this crap from PBAP. “Crap from PBAP”, it sounds like poetry :) Can’t compare India to US/Europe … >> You cannot, they are much more advanced/mature than us. About consumer spending, they have created a market to sell outdated technology in India. The LCD TVs you buy today in India use technology used and thrown away 5-8 years back in these countries. 30% below market level … 60% sold out … >> People bought shares at 21K, 18K, 16K, 14K, 12K, 10K, 8K … They always sell. We should be smart to differentiate between, who bought at 14K (and why?) and who bought at 8K. Who remembers ‘analysts’ speaking it cannot go below 10K? Simply not possible sir :) Today nobody want’s to predict the bottom :) So … things may not really crash in 4 months, but I see a downtrend with no bottom. This is something to do with sentiment .. the DESIRE Darshit mentioned. These hard times have made me think more for my and my children’s future than a house that is un-affordable, no value for money and for which I have no dire need today. Thank you all for reading through this.

  151. Folks, Recession is looming large on IT industry.So called ‘Stable Infosys’ is firing at a rapid pace.2100 already fired in the name of self cleaning process & now unconfirmed sources are telling that they are layoffs being done for taking personal print outs from office. Infy officials have admitted that its the worst time of their life,they are badly hit http://specials.rediff.com/money/2009/apr/16sld1-infosys-ceo-on-slowdown-and-the-way-ahead.htm No appraisals for Infocians this year: http://business.rediff.com/report/2009/apr/17/infosys-to-freeze-april-wage-hike-promotions.htm Hold tight your cash till the recession & layoffs scenario improves. Cheers, Ashwin

  152. Guys, think about it… the cash is dear… and the builders are already tight… if any of you or me buys something now there is every probability that the construction quality will be worse than ever. So even if the prices are down, and the builder as we know, sucks, they will definitely compromise on the quality of the product… some of you might be enticed to see lower prices but for sure lot will be compromised for now atleast, until they realize it as a fact of life and the thouhgt sinks in and all the fuss stabilizes… I would say hang tight on this… and let the prices be dragged down as much as possible… atleast some compensation for the quality you will buy… Akhil Sharma

  153. Friends, The recession time wont recover before 2011. So please hold the cash for survival. Dont have any EMI. Dont buy property. Coming days are very tough and be prepared. Kiran More

  154. Thanks Dheeraj & Prakash both for sharing your view points and special thanks to Prakash for thinking that i am a rep of PBAP.. well sadly though but i am another professional like you all and trying to understand the scenario for my personal benefit.. well i must say a well written & explained and i agree to most of it but i wont reply in length here but i the bubble had to burst and it did burst and i am also of the same view point. Please read my article above , who is responsible in the first place for creating this kind of bubble in the first place. was 2008 real estate prices the only one that was bloated , was not 2006 /2007 also bloated and why all just blindly kept on buying. why didnt people like you and others come together and stop this from happening, that the day 5 of bubble and 2008 – day 9/10 of this bubble. This is not a blame but am wondering why then noone came strong defying the buying , many professionals like us would have been saved then…This number is huge , very huge who would be currently underwater. Well all my focus here would be on price level drop in coming months in continuing with my previous post , Yes i havent done my homework but still i have some theories… 1)Ask a family to compare talk about their Family Budget (2004/08) 2)Ask a family to compare talk about Tourism Budget (2004/08) 3)similary salary 4)A simple day – Movies / Dinner 5)How many people own car Now as of earlier… 6)If one is hired , does a fresher join @ 2004 level or 2008 level and if i am not mistaken around 3L is the starting salary and infosys still honoring 28k employeed for this fiscal year … and similarly with other companies , they did have an impact but has impacted hiring , it has definitely impacted paying unrealistic salaries to professionals. in other words some sanity has returned to IT sector but overall it still stands firm and stable and i see this trend to continue as this economy is different from year 2000 , where IT was responsible for the crash and here it has an after effect. you are right with regards to US Market , but they always lived in debt and for them its just another figure… well even if the economy shows receovery signs , jobs will be lost well into next year , but are we talking here about USA… To tell you , this is benefitting , i have many onsite collegues and their onsite contacts have been terminated and more offshore positions being created .. so more Jobs back home , money coming in and then fuelling demand..This is the common case with almost all projects , push work offshore…. I am from Mumbai and you would be surprised , with so much professionals now commuting to work in a car , the employers were forced to charge Rs 4000 PM from the employees for parking if they needed a fixed place. i am sure not all would avail of this , but definitely some did and hence this practise by employers.(nothing changed since 2004) i would talk pure basic here , In pune do you see the new concept of “Fine Dining Restaurants”.. did you see them in 2004…. I agree nothing has changed except property , think about it , major change has occured with the way we live and see life of tomorrow … Desire and not need of a 25 Year Old professional of buying a house and Car created demand. Never before did a professional desire to own so early in his career and this desire still remains and hence the You cant compare US / Europre with India , India had never seen such consumer spending and all sectors benefitted , agreed it went a overboard and hence the bubble burst but to say that we will continue to fall to 2004 levels means a disaster. dont get me wrong i am not worried abt real esate PBAP prices here but i am meaning relative here , for prices to fall the entire Job Market of India / related Growth and GDP will have to crash and i dont see that at all happening. I am being positive here and i am trying to differentiate here with bloated prices with real prices and all in this discussion i am trying to reach the real prices figure. Moreover , if i am not mistaken we had slump in real estate from 1995 onwards till 2002 and it started to stabilize / gain strength only 01/02.. well in places like Pune not before 03/2004….all we want is the real estate prices to stabilize to more realistic terms & even if the markets turn +ve , a more conservative and restrained approach is needed to buy. You shared an article this Morning about Mumbai Andheri and Kurla , HDIL — These projects launched and got a good response(60%) from the buyers … why?? they were below the market level @ Launch — Yes (30%) (This is just launch and such projects take time to get completed and in such scenario who knows whether they will @ what pace) but nowhere close to 2004 levels — (still 100% of 2004 & still they got 60% sold out) This is Mumbai i am talking about and things could be a bit different for Pune but expecting to go to 2004 levels triggers a collapse and i dont see that happening or rather i wish that doesnt happen. anyways i will continue to read this blog and follow your comments and hope for the best for rest of 2009 / 10, 4 Months not too far … Thanks Darshit

  155. READ THIS LINK – IMPORTANT – http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Markets/Real-Estate/Realty-Trends/No_clear_sign_of_recovery_in_real_estate_market/articleshow/4366527.cms

  156. Thanks Dheeraj for taking up the point. Darshit, the fact that my posting is in context to my previous analysis posted above in this chain. Enough of reasoning stated earlier. But my main doubt is do you really belong to IT Sector or you are a representative of PBAP trying to gauge the market feel by posing such irrational questions to people of Pune. Thus, you want to know what is happening in their minds, give a feedback to PBAP thereby they can strategise and stay connected to see that How Prices Can be Kept Constant – high as JAN-2008 etc… etc… I mean I can sense something fishy easily. Let it be. Lets take a review afresh – 1. Global surprises are still hidden. US problems will resurface afresh with new artifacts which our normal eyes fail to see. This is Fiscal Deficit of over US $ 1.1 Trillion and each passing day is just adding to this deficit. US will not be able to come out of it as it has been perceived. Unemployment is at its peak and we will soon see new peaks being attained. Europe is lackluster for entire FY’09 & FY’10. Thus there is very little chance that economy will be robust anytime before FY’11. 2. Asian economies are stable only due to Exports to US & European markets. Thus, stimulus plans of China & Japan will just dry off in couple of months and will not assist in reviving the economy. Gone are the days where domestic growth supported the GDP. This view held by many analysts is actually vague since they fail to realise that domestic growth was in a way trigered by Free Flow of Credits and economy boost posed by their respective exports. This money was getting circulated within the country making it to feel as if the economy was growing internally. If this was the case then Indian & China should have retained respective growth rates of 9% & 12% irrespective of collapse of global economy. What I mean to say is – When the root dries, the tree normally dry a bit later & that’s the ground reality. 3. IT boom which was the nerve of this so called growth is again dependant on US & Europe markets flourishing in their sunny days. Once this aspect dries it will impact directly on the IT industry forcing it to face the heat may be a bit later in the chain of actions & reactions. This has already resulted in Infosys, TCS and other majors anouncing lay-offs, few anouncing pay-cuts, few anouncing no growth in salaries. Overall triggering uncertainty for IT Industry. This will have direct impact on investment plans. 4. Banks are reluctant to lend to Construction Companies and wherever the bigges are successful in getting loans re-scheduled, they get it at a price…. i.e. higher interest rates and reduction in the total re-payment period, restrictions on so many fronts…. 5. Change in Government anticipated thus has a negative effect on the overall scenario. 6. The inflated prices of property is such a big blown ballon that with a meager 20-30% correction is NOT AT ALL going to trigger buying passion in this country. People of India have understood the game plan of these greedy builders. 7. Its a hard fact that this GDP Growth of India & China had its roots in US & Europe economies. Now if these economies have corrected to Price LEvels of YEAR-2000, and the India boom history started at the beginning of YEAR-2004 then to HELL with these LUSTY GREEDY BUILDERS they must correct Prices to YEAR-2004 levels mandatorily. I say this is the bare minimum requirement. They should infact go beyond by dropping to YEAR-2002 Price Levels. If they dont they will pay for it, if they do, then they will come out of the mess which they have created and no one else is responsible for it. 8. Share Market has no doubt gone up from 8K to 10K+ in last 1 months but this is not attributed to any kind of strong base either of domestic growth or global growth. This is pure speculation and manipulation by existing government and normally happens prior to any election in India. Please go back and trace the history you will notice this surge and sudden downfall soon after the results declared or during the government formation phase. 10K-11K will sustain only if Congress forms the government which is unlikely to happen under all given circumstances. So we again come back to square 1. okay. 9. Sorry to say, I feel you haven’t done the homework. The increase in cost of living, increase in salaries, increase in other amenities etc…. stated by you are the artifacts of this artifical boom created on basis of Free Flowing Credits. This is clear artificial growth. Just tell me what exactly has gone up 400%-500%, whether its your annual income, standard of living – nothing, I say NOTHING except for Property Prices. India is where it was in YEAR-2004 except for few groups who have made enough money out of this artifically created boom. So the BURST has to happen & has taken place. What builders are doing is trying to resist it as long as they can withstand on the basis of money they have milked during the last 3-4 years. This won’t carry them too far may be they can drag a bit more for next 3 – 4 months. Hence period of 4-6 months they will fall flat. If they don’t, then PEOPLE OF INDIA WILL STILL CONTINUE THIS STRUGGLE OF NOT BUYING EVEN A SINGLE HOUSE FOR ANOTHER 3 MONTHS TILL THEY COME TO YEAR-2004 PRICE LEVELS. How long will it last finally. There has to be an END and END will be with YEAR-2004 Prices of Rs.1100-1250 psf Rates and maintaining it for another 2 – 3 years. 10. Bank Interest rates are near YEAR-2004 LEVELS and will touch in the next correction anticipated on 21st April RBI Meet. Oil has fallen immediately to YEAR-2002 LEVEL. You name it and it has corrected to YEAR-2002 & YEAR-2004 LEVELS then WHY NOT PROPERTY???? 11. HELL MAN….. YEAR-2002 YEAR-2004 Parking was available at meager Rs.25K – 35K. MSEB, Society, Maintenance etc…. was meager Rs.20K-30K. Now these GREEDY LOT have increased it to Rs.1.5 Lacs – 2 Lacs Parking, MSEB etc…. to Rs. 80K…… BAAP KA MAAL SAMAJ KE RAKKHA HAI KYA…. FOKAT NAHI AATA PAISA SAAALO….. 12. So wake-up, and awaken others. Show them these facts, make them understand. Make them understand that these Builders are riding on emotions of innocent people of India, People of Pune. 80% of home buyers are salaried people with a dream of owning a good house in decent locality. Dream of giving a good life to their parents, wife, children. BUT these GREEDY, LUSTY BUILDERS are trying to sqeeze them. Its our HARD EARNED MONEY which we have to pay for next 15 – 20 Years in EMI’s. If we save now, by not buying single flat and in fact buying at YEAR-2003 YEAR-2004 PRICE LEVELS we will save on an average Rs. 10K – 15K PER MONTH OF EMI. This is awesome money man for any salaried person. There are many more reasons & analysis. I prefer to stop here and suggest read previous posts where you will get few additonal points. SUMMARY – == DON’T BUY EVEN A SINGLE HOUSE TILL THEY REACH YEAR-2004 LEVELS== == HELP YOURSELVE, HELP OTHERS == == MAKE A BETTER LIFE WITH YOUR OWN HANDS & GIVE A BETTER LIFE TO YOUR FAMILY & CHILDREN == == FLOG THESE LUSTY GREEDY BUILDERS ==

  157. Hi guys, Darshit, I appreciate ur views, I also agree with Prakash, well if we think smart at this point we can wait for at least 4 months that much time we all have with us, now think in this way, property prices are gone down already, lots of people lost there jobs or salary are being reduced, in such a situation no company are going to suddenly raise salaries at least for 1 or 2 years. As now the companies wants to make trends of low salary in India and all over the world, so they can gain more profit or make recovery, so in this case even though the share market goes up only companies will be in profit not the employees and employees are the one who gives the business to builders, so if the prices are not affordable no body is going to buy or invest in properties. so ultimately builders will not have much business for this period and if they want to do business then they will not raise the prices again they will not take any kind of risk, and if builders wants to hold there projects for 2 years or so, again they will be in loss as they also took loans from banks and all and the rate of interest on big amounts are not bearable, So now the overall thing is that they can’t take risk to raise up the cost of property and neither can just hold up the progressing projects as also the old pending construction will cost at depreciation value and people will also try to avoid it. so we can now expect more fall in properties and wait for more 4 months we’ll still gain before increasing the rates of the properties they will have to stabilize the rates first then make a continues trends and as the salary trends increase the rates of property will again increase. Don’t forget that the major factor for up going property rates is salary hikes in BPO’s & IT industries. so as far as these industries are struggling we can hope +ve with Prakash. well I think we all can think more deep in this and can get another view. after all it’s all our hard earned money. what u say?

  158. Hi guys, Darshit, I appreciate ur views, I also agree with Prakash, well if we think smart at this point we can wait for at least 4 months that much time we all have with us, now think in this way, property prices are gone down already, lots of people lost there jobs or salary are being reduced, in such a situation no company are going to suddenly raise salaries at least for 1 or 2 years. As now the companies wants to make trends of low salary in India and all over the world, so they can gain more profit or make recovery, so in this case even though the share market goes up only companies will be in profit not the employees and employees are the one who gives the business to builders, so if the prices are not affordable no body is going to buy or invest in properties. so ultimately builders will not have much business for this period and if they want to do business then they will not raise the prices again they will not take any kind of risk, and if builders wants to hold there projects for 2 years or so, again they will be in loss as they also took loans from banks and all and the rate of interest on big amounts are not bearable, So now the overall thing is that they can’t take risk to raise up the cost of property and neither can just hold up the progressing projects as also the old pending construction will cost at depreciation value and people will also try to avoid it. so we can now expect more fall in properties and wait for more 4 months we’ll still gain before increasing the rates of the properties they will have to stabilize the rates first then make a continues trends and as the salary trends increase the rates of property will again increase. Don’t forget that the major factor for up going property rates is salary hikes in BPO’s & IT industries. so as far as these industries are struggling we can hope +ve with Prakash.

  159. Hi guys, Darshit, I appreciate ur views, I also agree with Prakash, well if we think smart at this point we can wait for at least 4 months that much time we all have with us, now think in this way, property prices are gone down already, lots of people lost there jobs or salary are being reduced, in such a situation no company are going to suddenly raise salaries at least for 1 or 2 years. As now the companies wants to make trends of low salary in India and all over the world, so they can gain more profit or make recovery, so in this case even though the share market goes up only companies will be in profit not the employees and employees are the one who gives the business to builders, so if the prices are not affordable no body is going to buy or invest in properties. so ultimately builders will not have much business for this period and if they want to do business then they will not raise the prices again they will not take any kind of risk, and if builders wants to hold there projects for 2 years or so, again they will be in loss as they also took loans from banks and all and the rate of interest on big amounts are not bearable, So now the overall thing is that they can’t take risk to raise up the cost of property and neither can just hold up the progressing projects as also the old pending construction will cost at depreciation value and people will also try to avoid it. so we can now expect more fall in properties and wait for more 4 months we’ll still gain before increasing the rates of the properties they will have to stabilize the rates first then make a continues trends and as the salary trends increase the rates of property will again increase. Don’t forget that the major factor for up going property rates is salary hikes in BPO’s & IT industries. so as far as these industries are struggling we can hope +ve with Prakash. well I think we all can think more deep in this and can get another view. after all it’s all our hard earned money. what u say?

  160. well I would love to agree with Prakash in what he is saying but i dont see any analysis provided by him to support this . I am also a IT professional like you most guys and have interest to understand real estate trends & followed this blog and several other blogs since long but i am unable to follow the recent comments. When i read the comments that this from Prakash, i feel that he desires and wants(speculations and predictions) but no supporting analysis. See there is no harm in predicting for prices to fall to 2004 but on what basis? world has changed tremendously since 2004 , agreed the economy is not doing great yet but India had a minimal impact. Are we ready to take the salaries to 2004 Levels(people had 100-200% rise in this time period) Cost of Living has increased? Overall Stock Market had 6k – 19k(Back to 10k & moving up)(((follow this sign for real estate signs) Crash in real estate is mainly due to over bloated prices but it doesnt mean that 2004 levels a logical price. All i am saying here is , waiting too long might hamper al of us as we may never know when this takes a UTurn and we may no longer be able to benefit from current low prices and believe me current low prices are interesting atleast the ones with ready possession. Under contruction has a genine financial problem i believe. Real estate was the last to be impacted when other thngs were effected and it will also show +ve signs when other things move out and believe me when these symptoms come again , the PBAP will not sell any inventory till they see the boom again and jack up all prices again…so we loose the chance to save money? Again i said this is still speculation from my end too , but we all know this quarter and results will decide which way economy headed. Its all related , so if Earlier there was a very healthy conversation between dutt & Ranjeeth and Ranjeeth came with very nice analysis and supporting data that made us believe him. Prakash if you have some data and not articles by others that are used to keep the print medium working , might help myself and lot of other folks.

  161. Also, READ THIS – http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?sectionName=HomePage&id=b70d8ce2-51ed-48d8-813e-60e1ced91078&Headline=Buyers+fight+back%2c+exit+stalled+housing+project AND READ THIS – http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/Features/The-Sunday-ET/IBA-asks-PSBs-to-help-realty-cos-finish-projects/articleshow/4390150.cms BUILDERS ARE CRYING FOR SURVIVAL AND WILL SOON COME TO TERMS. == WE HAVE TO JUST WAIT WITHOUT GIVING A SINGLE CHANCE FOR BUY == == THIS ALONE WILL BE OUR SUCCESS PATH ==

  162. Folks, Its largely agreed that DLF and Unitech primarily set the trend for realty in India. Lets see whats the fate of these guys – DLF Offered 20% Discount over and above the Low Price they had offered, yet People who bought flats paid booking amounts, are now demanding EXIT OPTION altogether (i.e. rejecting 20% further discount offered by DLF). This is the same report published by so called PBAP Cartel Partner News Papers of Pune that Property is staging return with 2% – 3% rise in bookings in the Jan-Mar quarter. DLF has SCUMED to Pressure & agreed to give EXIT OPTION. Day is not too far when PBAP of Pune will also come to terms with Reality of Realty and offer YEAR-2004 PRICE LEVELS of Rs.1100-1250 psf Rates. Just wait for another 4-6 months. Better to stay with minimum liabilities of a rented place and enjoy the downfall of ego of these builders. This is a BIG BOOST to our ongoing fight with PBAP to come to YEAR-2004 PRICE LEVELS. IT WILL HAPPEN IF WE STAND UNITED & DONT GO FOR EVEN A SINGLE BUY IN NEXT 4-6 MONTHS. READ THIS REPORT – AWAKEN YOURSELF AND OTHERS – DON’T GO FOT A BUY- http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-india/dlf-offers-exit-option-to-irate-customers-of-new-town-heights-project.html#more-2467 == PLEASE INFORM ALL YOUR PEERS, RELATIVES, FRIENDS, UNKNOWN PEOPLE WHO TALK OF BUYING NOW == STOP NOW TO EARN BETTER DEALS FOR TOMORROW == == THINK OF YOUR HARD EARNED MONEY == THINK OF YOU GIVING A BETTER LIFE, AMINITIES, LUXURY TO YOUR CHILDREN FROM THE BIG SAVINGS OF NEARLY Rs.10K – 15K PER MONTH FROM EMI’s TO BANKS ==

  163. Hi Guys, Can we, all the members of this thread,will publish a news paper against these builders..because we are few members and this message should be spread all over Pune. PM , do you write article for us to publish this as you have good observation of pune property.

  164. Folks, Get this bullshit from POORVA HEIGHTS, PASHAN-SUS ROAD Project. I had enquired with this fellow in August-2008. The rates quoted were Rs.3300 psf. I said okay, they will come to reality in few months and skipped it. I called them yesterday i.e. 12th April 2009 and to my surprise the fellow quotes Rs.3600 psf claiming quality construction, access road, water etc…. and says come to site we will negotiate. ==== MAN CLEAR BULL SHIT ==== PBAP is trying all means to screw people of Pune. Now let People of Pune screw the PBAP and all its branches. DON’T GO FOR EVEN A SINGLE BUY FOR NEXT 6 MONTHS, YOU WILL BE SURPRISED TO SEE BUILDERS ON THEIR KNEES YELLING FOR YEAR-2004 PRICES AND WE WILL THEN QUOTE THEM YEAR-2003 PRICES AND GET POSSESSION OF FLATS. Take it or Leave it. This must be the fate of PBAP and all its branches else we the People of Pune will suffer. Why only TOI, please read SAKAL or DNA or Maharashtra Times or Indian Express or any other News Paper, PBAP has entered into Cartel and News Papers have Sold themselves to PBAP like Prostitutes, Keeps…… Bull Shit Man. Even all Internet dot.com fellows show crab figures of January-2008 and upon question does not agree to drop down prises. SCREW THEM ALL. DONT BUY EVEN A SINGLE FLAT. Those who bought flats & was reported by bullshit papers in big way, that hopeless consultant JLLM some Meghraj too made it big of return of realty etc…. are the same people now asking for RETURN OF BOOKING AMOUNT, stagging Dharnas, screwing builders to pay back money. THIS IS THE REALITY and NOT THAT IS SHOWN TO US THROUGH VARIOUS REPORTS – READ THIS – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-india/35-fall-is-expected-in-residential-property-rates.html#more-2460 READ THIS – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-india/retailers-shut-shop-at-dlf-south-delhi-malls.html YOU MUST READ THIS – http://www.hindustantimes.com/StoryPage/StoryPage.aspx?sectionName=HomePage&id=b70d8ce2-51ed-48d8-813e-60e1ced91078&Headline=Buyers+fight+back%2c+exit+stalled+housing+project WE MUST START WRITING TO ALL NEWS PAPERS OF PUNE AND BUILD PRESSURE TO REPORT THE LATEST PRICES AREAWISE ELSE WE WILL START NEGATIVE PROPOGANDA OF YOUR NEWS PAPER IN CITY. ==== DEKHO BHAI ACHHAI KA JAMANA NAHI RAHA, JISKE HAAT LATHI USKI BHEIS. DHAMKAO TO SIDHE RASTE CHALENGE YE LOG. ==== I HAVE THOUGHT OF IT….. NOW ITS YOUR TURN TO TURN OUT AND MAKE IT HAPPEN IN YOUR INDIVIDUAL CAPACITY…. WHAT ABOUT HBA (HOUSE BUYERS ASSOCIATION)?

  165. Sensible people in India stopped believing TOI data ages ago. But it might still probably be worth for timepass, if at all. TOI = Timepass Of India :)

  166. Welcome to Times of India (TOI) Saturday Property bullshit supplement. As per TOI corrrespondent (believe she is reporting from New York :)), new projects have been launched in the past 2 months and have REPORTEDLY been sold out :) Builders (read PBAP) as always say its the bank’s fault of higher interest rates :) Madam, please see in today’s supplement even MAGARPATTA has advertized! These folks believed till now that they need no advertisement! Very arrogant folks – you could know that when they launched the now doomed Nanded City project. What clues does this give you? Week after week benchmark rates reported by this sleepy organization (Some Italian and Desi company mix – Something Meghraj) do not change. Believe they have been the same since I have started reading this supplement 2 years back (I think instead of doing their research these guys go to the PBAP office and ask, Sir, kitna likh doon:)). TOI and this benchmark brother company all make money from PBAP. And you the house buyer pays for all this crap in terms on increased psf rates. See the irony, your money is used AGAINST you! As per this week’s article, everybody is happy. The builders are happy and buyers are happy. Do you sense bullshit going on … and that too in a newspaper like TOI. Well lots of bullshitting happens but this one is so glaring that I could not resist. To dismiss benchmarks, office sales folks who sit in the Sales office of projects in Kharadi are quoting 2400-2800 NEGOTIABLE (Depending on which project you personally visit). This Benchmark tells you KHARADI 3000 – 3500 All text, no mention of specific projects, no mention of rates, no mention of trend with stats. Only statements made by the lion (read PBAP members) – I have turned vegetarian :) So as Prakash guides us above, guys where is the NEED to buy your own house? Is there a shortage of good rentals in the city today – There is in-fact an OVERSUPPLY of them? Save your hard earned money, it will help you and your family in times of need. There will always be a right time and global clues would tell you that.

  167. Floks, Read this and u will be AMAZED with the reality of Realty market – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/property-prices/next-5-6-years-may-witness-60-decline-in-real-estate-prices-edelweiss.html This is THE Reality of Realty. So don’t get bogged down by threats from PBAP or some funky analysis / predictions by X, Y, Z person on this blog or elsewhere. Read these links too – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/nri/depleting-nri-interest-force-developers-to-put-projects-on-hold.html BEWARE OF THIS TREND AND RESIST TILL THE LAST MOMENT – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-india/pune/city-developers-reluctance-to-drop-prices-provides-business-opportunity-to-hometown-developers.html Guys, remember, propagate, create awareness, convince other guys, do whatever you can do to make it happen – WHAT – DON’T GO FOR MEAGER 20-30% DISCOUNT SCHEMES OR ANY OTHER TYPE OF SCHEMES LAUNCHED BY BUILDERS JUST TO WOOO CUSTOMERS. REAL SAVING FOR YOU WILL BE WHEN BUILDERS DROP TO YEAR-2004 LEVEL @1100 – 1250 psf RATES. == REMEMBER ALWAYS ==


  169. Hey Ashwin, The problem you are facing is what many of us here do – where is the value for my money? 1.75L for covered parking. You get the sunshine yellow Nano LX for that price! O I would die for it … but a covered parking for that price. Are you crazy :) Seriously. 1 covered parking should be free with every flat. Everyone owns a car these days. They are not a luxury anymore. Builders are just looting us. Check the cars they own :) LAND ROVER and what not. Who paid for that? You! It should have been your car. It is heartening to see that there is STILL ONE GULLIBLE for every 25 potential buyers. Sad. Very sad. Guys, there is only one solution to this greed. STOP BUYING FLATS completely till sanity returns. Believe me there are enough flats are good prices available on rent in Pune. Why do you need to buy one where you can clearly see the LOOT. This is your hard earned money. Here is a nice incident. I went to enquire about a 3BHK on rent this weekend. The broker quoted 12K as rent for this 1650 square feet flat. I asked why the high prices. He said the owner bought it for 50 Lakhs. I replied – That is his problem. I am not here to pay his EMI. He had no reply. There are no takers guys for these crazy rentals also. Walk to Kharadi (my area) and get 3 BHKs for 9K on rent in good societies. It may not have a jacuzzi, but do you care? Don’t believe me – Check on m a g i c b r i c k s

  170. Folks, Builders are badly hit …I spoke to one of receptionist at Pimple Saudagar area (since I stay at that place)she said that the conversion ratio of enquiry to booking has come down from 4:1 to 25:1 :):) Thhose project which are in construction phase the work is going on very slowly…builders are in helpless state. The upcoming projects are on hold. @PM One of the instance where the builder boasts of “different theme flats ” is Rajaveer palace by GK builders…in which the flats are bult on palace themes.Rates at 3300 psf,project would still take another year for completeion.Crazy loot … Similarly my neighbour who owns flat enquired about covered parking …rate 1.75 L !!! This is too much …Still I do not understand the concept of open & closed parking.Common yar its the free space which builder could not utilize so he’s started selling it…& we people mindlessly purchase it.

  171. CORRECTION: There is a small typo in the calculations above. Your profit from buying property should be 11.72 lakhs instead of 11.42 as mentioned and so you make 1 lakh more speculative in 3 years than playing safe in an FD. Calculation in a Loan scenario ——————————————– I said above that the calculations do not hold true when one takes a loan and is completely at loss. Some real calculations reveal that if the same 3 year investment period, cost of flat and rent are considered then one may lose money to the tune of 71K per annum! Obviously, it does not take into consideration all the hassles arising from such buying/selling, brokerages, processing fees, prepayment charges, etc. etc, which if considered would show such a deal as being completely non-sensical. Purely for investors, here is the true picture. You like this ready possession Park Street flat in Wakad for 40 lakhs. You plan to make a killing by investing in it. You can only get 80% loan from bank that is 32 lakhs. You can cough up 8 lakhs lying in your bank to make it 40 lakhs. You take a loan at 10% floating from any bank (1% more than deposit rate) for 15 years. Commonly available calculators on the internet show EMI for this as 34386 per month. Similar calculators say that by the end of the third year, you would still owe the bank 28.77 lakhs. At the end of the 3rd year you sell your 40 lakh flat for an appreciated price of 48 lakhs (20% growth speculative). Over these years you were lucky to get a cool unrealistic rent of 12K per month. So you earned 4.32 lakhs as rent. You now have made 48 + 4.32 = 52.32 lakhs from this investment. You paid 70K as Capital Gains Tax on 8 lakhs (See previous post). So you really made 51.62 lakhs after tax. Now time to calculate how much you invested to make 51.62 lakhs? Over 3 years you pay back – 36 x 34386 ~ 12.38 lakhs in EMIs. You still owe the bank 28.77 lakhs. If you had invested 8 lakhs for 3 years at 9% in an FD, you would have made 2.41 lakhs. So real cost of this investment is: 12.38 + 28.77 + 2.41 = 51.56 lakhs So without having 40 lakhs cash, your investment has given you a cool 6K speculative in 3 years (2K per annum return). If you did not do any of this as just put your 8 lakhs in a safe FD, you would earn 73K per annum as interest money! So you lose 71K per annum over 3 years when taking a loan for this investment. Hope these calculations help someone. Days of investment in property are gone. Even the 20% appreciation used by me for illustration is not practical. You may not be in a position to sell your property at your buy price even after 5 years for the simple reason that you bought it at a crazy over inflated price today.

  172. Hey Keshav. So you are an investor. Good to know that. Well investment in property was good around 3 years back when it was like all sanity. Not anymore today. Investing in land, I completely agree with you about all issues that can be and is best for regular guys to stay out. It’s very very tricky. Today even equities is screwed up. Job market is bad :( So what to do? The gurus say that in such times CASH IS KING. Let us do some calculations with assumptions in your favor, like you have a tenant all thru 36 months without your flat lying idle for even a month. You do not pay maintenance for the flat you bought (which may be 2-3K per month). You do not spend on internal maintenance, like leaks in bathroom (Quite common because of excellent construction quality by reputed PBAP builder in Pune). You yourself do not change flats because your lease agreement got over, etc. So … all in your favor. You lucky guy. Let’s assume you had 40 lakhs cash lying idle in your bank account.You INVESTED this in Park street flat. You are earning 12K per month from rent for a 2BHK (Which is really really high. You lucky guy). Let me assume you have no other income so you do not pay tax on this. In 1 year you make 1.44 lakhs from rent. In 3 years you make 4.32 lakhs as rent. Assuming in 3 years time your property is worth 20% more (pure speculation) which you sell. So that is 48 lakhs. Capital gains Tax (20%) on 8 lakhs (after taking a realistic Cost Inflation Index of 1.12 over 3 years) would be close to 70K (Here I have exercised the previous assumption that you did not spend anything for maintenance of your flat in 3 years). Nett profit in 3 years = 7.1+4.32 = 11.42 lakhs. The FD interest you get today is 9% (was 11.5% 4 months back possibly when you bought your flat). Assuming you have no other income other than this interest, you would be paying approx 10% of this as tax, your nett profit/earnings come to 8.1% only. 8.1% of 40 lakhs compounded semi-annually for 3 years is 10.75 lakhs. So one has to choose between a no guarantee, all hassle, discountly calculated, nightmarish 11.42 lakhs vs a safe guaranteed 10.75 lakhs LIQUID CASH available the next day you want it. What would you choose? Hey you already choose to buy a flat at a crazy price. You lucky guy. Earning a speculative 70K more that others who did not go for the kill. These calculations do not hold true if you have taken a loan to buy a house because then one is completely at loss. Also a person who FD-ed his money at 11.5% would have made close to 13 lakhs tax paid interest money in 3 years using above calculations with tax adjusted to 15% instead of 10% for higher income. But that is history, so let us forget it. Buying a flat TODAY is more for emotional reasons than for investment purpose … and one needs to do that very sensibly. I’ll not talk about Wakad and all. Let some one else who is more familiar than me comment on Wakad being in the city. Hint: Please use Google Earth to do distance calculations :)

  173. @PM – I am also investor so don’t worry about where I’m working and all. I agree in Pune there is no centralized location as “IT Park”. Pune has got “IT park(s)” :-). Anyways, I would prefer to stay on rent near my office and put my house on rent. Land is good option over buying flat. But, you don’t get land cheap and litigation issues as well. Apart from taxation, you haven’t thought of the monthly rent as well. You get good rent now a days. I have 2BHK in Park Street, I bought at 40 lacs and fetching me rent of 12K. Mine is a garden facing, beautiful flat. You know how well park street is. So basically, I think it depends on which location you chose. Go to park street, Wakad – You will be happy. I think 2800/- garden facing for a ready possesion is quite good rate there. I’m not marketing or not intending to sell my flat as such, but i know it’s one of it’s kind of project. Green , quiet place. in the city and still far quite as well. Cheers! KK.

  174. Not talking of property, this will give you a fair idea on what to expect as companies announce their books in the days to come. PBAP builders however would surely announce a profit. Thanks to all the gullibles they could still milk in the past financial year :) 28 billion Euros loss! http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Business/Fortis-bank-announces-28bn-loss/articleshow/4338787.cms Sensex to break 8000 – Only a matter of time http://www.moneycontrol.com/mccode/news/article/news_article.php?autono=391076&special=mkt_topnews

  175. @Kiran, rates quoted seem attractive, but a lot of other factors need to be taken into account, specially other projects by similar builder and the square feet area. 7 lakh for 300 square feet is expensive :) Location also does matter a lot, so if it is in like Chakan or Talegaon villages, forget it. You won’t be travelling 50 kms one way I presume. These days everything 100 kms within Pune Rly station seems to be publicised as Pune :) so new comers to Pune BEWARE. The benchmark areas when we say 1BHK, 2 BHK and 3 BHK should be (built up area): Slum rehabilitation scheme – < 600 sq feet (You get this for the land you give up) 1 BHK – 600-800 sq feet (Should be under 10 lakhs) 2 BHK – 800-1100 sq feet (Should be under 15 lakhs) 2.5 BHK – 1100 – 1300 sq feet (Should be under 20) lakhs 3 BHK – 1300-1800 sq feet (Should be under 30 lakhs) 4BHK and above – You would not be on this forum :) (Carpet area may be lesser) Also we are not discussing Amanora (non India project for non Indians) where a teeny weeny 2 BHK starts at 59 lakhs :) BTW you get a Railway Station free with it if you care :) I don’t know if they still sell this. It’s one funny project I know of in Pune. Other please post such other loot/unrealistic projects if you know about.

  176. I understand Keshav. Till it is not in the newspapers and announced by builders/PBAP, people feel that the rates have not come down and they don’t even feel like making an enquiry even though they have loads of cash. It’s the value problem I say. I see no value for my hard earned money. I completely agree with you on your HOLDING policy, but unfortunately not everyone can hold, especially those on credit. Also with all your cash, what is the point if you get 20% (speculative) more for your property in 3 years time from today? It wiser to sell now, put the money in bank and get more than 20% (assured) in return. I have ignored all taxation rules here for simplicity. Also today, there are more chances that you get laid off and are forced to take a new job. There is no single IT park in Pune. Its all spread across, so if your work happens to move away from your existing house, it may be like 25-30 kms one way travelling everyday! It may also be that you look for opportunities in another city. Stay on cheap rentals close to your workplace till the times of stability and sanity and back. It will take not less than 2 years for the markets to revive. The point I wish to make is – What is the reason for desparation for home buyers if they are happy staying in a rented acco of their choice! and believe me there are plenty everywhere in Pune at good rates. Its only the sellers who are desparate today for reasons of the property bubble coupled with PBAP attitude that only applies to the city of Pune. Another point – Investors today are investing in land and no one wants to buy shit property in far off locations ar crazy prices. This is the general opinion of the group here. Lastly this is not a seller’s forum and we are all well researched folks.

  177. I believe we have reached rock bottom and expecting further reduction is foolishness. Please be very careful while buying the under construction property as it won’t be completed in 5 years, whereas the ready property won’t be sold at cheap rate as sellers like me are waiting for the right price according to us. happy to receive your feedback, comment at kamat79@gmail.com Cheers! KK.

  178. Mr Gera is not in sync with Mr Jain. Gera claims in Pune mirror today (Mar 31, 09) that property prices have drpped 30% and in some places are to the rates that existed 2 years back. Jain (ROCK-BOTTOM guy) says prices cannot go down further :) Over all, every week TOI keeps on publishing absurd benchmark proerty rates for various areas in Pune. No one is in sync. TOI needs to do a lot more to build confidence in teir property news. Presently its all bullshitting and publishing what they get paid for by PBAP.

  179. Friends, Few days back I saw one ad 1 BHK for 11L and 2 BHK for 16 L. Today my work mate saw one ad 1 BHK for 7L and 2 BHK for 10 L. Its better if we wait for some more time. Kiran

  180. Arun Prabhudesai

    To all who are interested in HBA, Extremely sorry that there has been no update over last few days from my side on HBA. I have been out of station for last 2 weeks due to some unplanned visits, hence could not meet up for HBA. I will shortly be announcing the date and venue for HBA meeting. I am planning the meeting somewhere around camp area. I am open to suggestions. We could even meet up at someone’s place, if it can accomodate. Also, there have been couple of Newspapers who have contacted us, and they would be interested in covering us as well. So media coverage can really help propel this HBA Organization. The Agenda for the meeting would be too identify key members who could give couple of hours every week for the sake of this organization and also to form a first draft guideline on the vision of this organization. I have around 10 members who have emailed me showing their interest. I would also urge more members to send an email at admin at trak.in . I will announce the dates and venue on 4-5 of April. Lets do it !!!!!

  181. Arun…. Whats about HBA ? When we are forming HBA assocation ?

  182. Hi Guys, Check these links WORTH IT – http://www.livemint.com/2009/03/19214909/DLF-begins-refunds-to-some-buy.html http://www.dnaindia.com/report.asp?newsid=1241110

  183. Hi Guys, Check below link – 53% PROPERTIES UNSOLD – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/real-estate-india/53-built-homes-remain-unsold-in-metros.html#more-2377 BANKS RELUCTANT – BUILDERS RUNNING PILLAR TO POST – http://www.indianrealtynews.com/banking-and-finance/banks-reluctant-to-fund-real-estate-companies.html#more-2379 So its time to unitedly hang-on and not go for that 2% – 3% increase in Home Purchases – Please hang-on don’t spoil the show by purchasing it now.

  184. Hi! Pls tell me for how much would i get a 2bhk flat in pune? I mean how much EMI? And is it worth Taking on Loan and Paying Part of EMI by rent you get? Sonki

  185. Good lord. Lot has happened since I last checked. Magnificient idea about the HBA. Me in too. Have lots of ideas me have. Will discuss in the gathering. Keep it going guys.

  186. Arun, What is happning insted of real estate i m getting mail updates of IT companies and Banking, is it possible for u to block it nad i can get only real estate updates. Anyways guys what is happning with HBA, how many ppl are intrested and how many are going for meeting, it is my bad i can’t come as i m out of India, but i would like to know about it and join u all. and also from last few days u all are so quite

  187. I prety late in this discussion. Already everyone knows that the real estate sector struggling due to cash crunch. There is definetely going to be a price reduction atleast by 40% to 50% in about a quarter.

  188. Guys I agree with u all, I am also waiting for the fall till 60%, But all my other point is that we should not delay to form HBA, even after all the facts, we can’t ignore the posibilities, we can’t underestimate PABA These ppl have all kind of sources to make a fake picture in front of general house buyers, as a result of it where the sale of flats ware 0% in december 08, now it is like 2 to 3% so we neet to stop this too, if we keep the rate as low as 0% definetely prices can fall upto 60% to 80%, we need to make some efforts to bring that prices level to get the real flat at real price. We have to think from all the sides to get the correct picture so we can act on it effictively, Guys it is very simple, already the global economic slow down has put the opposit force to the high speed running train and the train has started pulling back, By forming ORG. Like HBA we can add some more opposit force to pull that train back as fast as we can. Coz this chance we are not going to get again. Remember that the train is still trying with it’s full force to break this slow down. Over all I mean to say the Let us not waste time and act effectively Kick these PBAP to there ground level and expose them to the real world ppl. Let ppl know that how these real eastate ppl blaff in reality, Let us make everybody understand that they should get real estate at the real price and when ever thay want.

  189. Many guys are loosing jobs. May be I will be one of them. No one will be ready to buy flats in pune even at cheaper rates. :(

  190. Rally Nice Thread to know, Is Real Estate Offering a Real Cost to Buy a Real Home ? from 2007 to till date .

  191. Hi Guys, don’t panic and spread the awareness. Don’t buy and also don’t let others buy. Then we will see how things don’t come down. Your panic is their gain. So be ware.


  193. Hi All, I agree with Mandar till some extend, as he said by sept 09 we’ll feel slow down, I think it is not going to happen like that, from last week I am observing the movements around the global slow down, The major economies are taking enough steps to resist the slow down, looking at the share markets there is lot of volatility but over all markets are doing fine most of the companies are going positive, last week markets ware 2% to 9% UP, this shows that the pricses for properties are not going to fall as much as we have pridicted like up to 50% as of pricses going now. but it may fall up to 20% to 35%, now looking at the trends in India, every year June-July-Aug are the low sale months, during these months rates are not increased much or even if they are increased builders offers some kind of discounts and all, on the other hand for the government employes, nothing much matters regarding the global slow down, they already got 6 Pay commision, BSNL has increased 30% pay, so now these people has got lot of money in there hands now and bank’s are also reducing the intrest rates and it’s easy to provide loan to government employees, now most of the government employees they beleave in collecting properties, so definately that is going to give some profits to builders so builders are also targeting these people, overall it says that builders are anyhow not going to bother to reduce the prices till our expectations, as they still have customers to buy there products like 1BHK flats that too on installments, this will keep on roling there money and they won’t go in loss, also they have lot of money to hold on. Due to elections we are not facing much effect of global slow down, and by the time like Aug-Sept, Global Share Markets will start doing well and the falling prices will stabalised so we can’t expect to feel much effect of global economic slow down, coz’ from sep-09 to nov-09 it will be stable and after that it’ll start recovering again. that would be some bad news again for property buyers. Guy’s in other words we do not have much time to form HBA, we should work more faster on this for effective performance, if we think that we can fight against these builders monopoly in the market, this and this is the right time to do it, if once the pricses become stable it will become more tough for us, we should keep force going on to lower the price of properties. Don’t let builders take a deep breath, if they are stabalised then they are ready to messup with us too. I hope everybody understands the importance of time.

  194. Friends, Forming HBA is a wonderful idea. I suggest – we should have a separate website of HBA. Hope, all legal proceedings are going well, unfortunately I can’t contribute much as I am based out of india but surely add value by spreading a word with as many people as possible. We need to be more careful in terms of disclosing our identities, because the guys we are protesting against are notorious and money powered and not to mention have tremendous political support. IF THE BUYERS REMAIN PATIENT FOR ANOTHER 1.5 YEARS, THINGS WILL AUTOMATICALLY CHANGE. YOU KNOW WHAT, IT’S ELECTION TIME. THIS IS THE ONLY REASON WHY WE DON’T FEEL THE REAL SLOW-DOWN, RULING GOVERNMENT ALWAYS TRY TO MAKE FEEL PEOPLE GOOD GOOD ONCE THE ELECTIONS ARE OVER, BY SEPTEMBER 09 WE SHOULD SEE CHANGE COMING SLOWLY. THE THINGS WILL BE UP-SIDE-DOWN BY MID 2010, NOT EARLY, BECAUSE BUILDER LOBBY HAS ENOUGH MONEY TO HOLD AS OF TODAY. WE NEED TO GIVE ENOUGH TIME TO BUILD ADEQUATE PRESSURE :) LET’S BE UNITED AND MAKE A BETTER WORLD FOR US UNITY IS STRENGTH KEEP POSTING GOOD AND POSITIVE INPUTS AND HAVE A HAVE A WONDERFUL “VASANTA” OUT THERE IN PUNE…. HAPPY GUDI-PADWA..!!!

  195. Bloody Hell with PBAP – Gera, Jain and all of the wrotten lots. No Cash In Hand and Blaming Government, PMC and other Civic Bodies.. WHERE THE HELL MONEY HAS GONE WHEN YOUR GREED LED TO RISE OF PROPERTY RATES BY MORE THAN 400% IN JUST 3 YEARS…… NOW WHEN YOU MUST REDUCE RATES AND IF YOU WON’T REDUCE PEOPLE OF PUNE WILL MAKE YOU REDUCE RATES BY 400% AND COME TO YEAR-2004 LEVEL. Guys don’t go by this shit. Builders have pocketed Heafty Margins by increasing property rates by 400%-500%. All this money is in their pocket and now they don’t want to shell it out. They want to show the world they are helpless, no cash in hand, threaten People of Pune by giving such statements like if Pune People don’t buy homes now at the rates they are ready to sell then People will not find one after few months as only 16,000 flats will be available. BULL SHIT WITH THESE BLOODY BUILDERS…… DON’T GO FOR A BUY…. They will come down on their knees with Rs.1100-1250 psf rates by June-2009 and these were the rates in YEAR-2004. Everything else in this world is back to the basics except PBAP and PUNE BUILDERS. This is purely systematic method of LOOTING, CHEATING, FORGERY CASE, SHRI 420 CASE against Builders, especially PBAP. STRICTLY DON’T GO FOR A BUY AT ALL, SAVE YOURSELF AND SAVE OTHERS. PLEASEEEEEEEE DON’TTTTT FALLLLL PREYYYYY TO THEIR TRICKSSSSSSSS.

  196. Dear all, I got this from one site, now PBAP wants to blame everything on Government and Bank intrest rates, which is not true at all they are just playing another game. At the end of this Jain said that price falling is not possible if there is a demand gap, Now is it really true, i think it’s just another game. Read the following. Severe cash crunch and falling sales have brought more than 450 real estate projects in Pune to a standstill. This has led to around 5,000 construction workers and many others losing jobs. By December 2009, only 16,000 new apartments would be unsold in Pune while the demand is more than 50,000. These numbers were revealed by a detailed survey undertaken by Promoters and Builders Association of Pune (PBAP), a body that represents a large number of real estate developers in Pune and surrounding regions. “Construction of cheaper flats is impossible for builders at a stage when there is severe credit crunch and the buying power of Pune residents has got stagnated due to higher home loan interest rates. This has formulated into a ‘deadlock’ which seems difficult to get resolved without active steps by the government of Maharashtra and Pune Municipal Corporation,” PBAP president and Kumar Builders chairman Lalitkumar Jain told Business Standard. A large number of real estate analysts have been projecting Pune as country’s top destination for real estate investment as the city has seen extensive growth in sectors of information technology, automobile, manufacturing, education and services. All this resulted into a sudden price hike across all locations in Pune and real estate properties saw an appreciation of more than 200 per cent within three years. However, the PBAP over the last four months has experienced a sudden fall in sales mainly due to higer interest rates. “We have come to a situation where we have asked all our members to sell flats at the lowest possible rates because banks are not keen on financing our new projects and unless our present flats are sold, we cannot start new projects,” Jain stated. Rohit Gera, another prominent developer from Pune said, the steps taken by the Reserve Bank of India (RBI) have helped bring down interest rates but the state government and local municipal corporation are adamant over taking any new measures to facilitate real estate growth. Gera stated, around 450 real estate projects in Pune and surrounding localities were at a standstill since developers do not have cash in hand. “Since projects are held up, more than 5,000 workers have lost jobs and a number of engineers, architects and allied workforce too have received pink slips. And still, the government has continued the readreckoner rates while the stamp duty for land development has been increased from one per cent to five per cent,” he added. The PBAP also blamed PMC for severe increase in various premium and development charges, which the builders have no option but to pass on to the end buyer. “Our survey show that by December 2009, there would be only 16,000 ready-to-sell flats available in Pune while the demand is of more than 50,000 units. If the demand-supply gap continues, there are no chances of prices falling,” Jain added.

  197. Dont get cheated by schemes announced by builders this “GudhiPadwa”. They are sucking our blood. Dont buy homes, & see that your friends, relatives also do not buy. Let the builders beg. Show builders that we are united, and your dadagiri will not be tolerated any more.

  198. Most interesting thread. Thanks for the link from India housing bubble blog. What is cost of construction for big builders like DLF? Is it also around 900 psf? Or more? What about the green area and other open spaces from builders like DLF – how much should that contribute to price psf? The big daddy – land price, how much psf? I am specifically interested in Gurgaon prices. How is 3070 psf by a top tier builder (Vatika)(including underground parking and all except stamp duty) sound to you?

  199. Arun, It went unnoticed while updating my comments that the check box is on for informing the new posts on this blog at my e-mail ID. My mail box becomes full and unable to handle on regular basis. Please remove updation of posts to my mail ID. Appreciate a confirmation Thanks.


  201. Makarand, I would suggest that let us not distract interested people or I would rather term this folk as beneficiaries of such a association by giving them 2 separate contact points such as one floated by Arun i.e. admin@trak.in and the other floated by you hbapune@in.com. I mean once HBA takes shape we can use this mail ID as an identity of it but for the time being it is easy for all to use this blog thread and it is advantagous to all to maintain the year long developments and capture the true picture. As suggested by Arun, we can always maintain this blog thread for all HBA Annoucements, interaction on daily basis so that new readers will get the true picture and they understand the value proposition of this blog, its participants and finally HBA. What u say????

  202. To, All friends, Please give the information about a temple in your neighbourhood area,where at least 50 people can accomadate.This will help us to conduct our first meeting.We will get more choice of locations and decide the ideal one for all suitably.If you have any suggestions and ideas,please mail at: hbapune@in.com

  203. Arun Prabhudesai

    Prakash, Dheeraj, Makarand and (4-5 other members who have already sent me a mail to be a part of this HBA ) – Thank you for your enthusiastic response….I agree with Prakash, Gudi Padwa…although a auspicious day may not be a good choice to hold a meeting. I am proposing 27th March evening between (6:30pm to 7:30pm) as the scheduled time for the meeting. We can meet up at a cafe or a restaurant if the crowd is single digits…if more we will have to make alternative arrangements…I request all of you to mail me directly (admin-at-trak.in) for any further communication on HBA…We will use this thread only for announcements so that this does not get very long… Jayesh, I am happy that you found this thread helpful..

  204. To, ALL, Please share your thoughts and ideas on hbapune@in.com

  205. Arun, it is really a excellent idea to stand against these builders and help everybody, i already sent you mail, but i can’t come to pune right now as i am out of India, there must be several more ppl like me who are intrested to join HBA, for now we can just communicate via email, but it will also be a good idea if we can have all of our group contact No’s. or some contact point no’s.

  206. I have been reading this thread for long time and it had really helped me for not making a biggest mistake in my life. One day I went to see flat around Dec 2007, I saw the flat it really attracted me with the amenities provided by the builder. Builder quoted me 3300 psf and total went to 48lk-51lk, I had 1 lk with me and on the next day I was about to make payment. I was thinking that flat is too costly but at that time people were rushing to buy flat at what ever the price builder quoted that made me panic and I felt that after few month if you buy the figure will go to 60-65 lk, on the same night I came across this thread as if God had sent this thread to save my hard earned money. Now this thread is really taking a shape by forming Home Buyers Association. I am looking forward to Join this Association and all the best to all the People who are reading this thread and to all who had given their analysis, Ideas, Views etc. Jayesh Shah 9421002345

  207. Dear Mr.Prakash, I appreciate your serious interest.If people like you come together,it will take very short time to achive our goal.As per your suggestion we difinately form the HBA in legal way and register the same.

  208. Hi Makarand and Arun, Its a good counter strategy to form a House Buyers Association. I would suggest a slight change. Gudi Padwa no doubt is a auspicious day for the occassion however it is reality that few will turn up for obvious reasons. Its better we schedule such a meeting on Saturday evening 28th March after office hrs say 6.30pm or 7.00pm or same timing on Sunday 29th March. We meet for an hr or so to put up a formal structure to this entity HBA. Unless HBA is registered it will not capture legal, valid response from Media, Authorities and even PBAP. Especially PBAP may try to use muscle power to give negative publicity about HBA illlegal existance etc…. I mean, if we are thinking of HBA we need to look in to all aspects and form a proper structured entity. Friends, colleagues, peers will try to join in after the first meeting I think so…. Arun, it is possible for you to convey to all a suitable meeting place and would appreciate if my suggestions on day & time are considered. This will be easy for all as most of them would belong to salaried class and obvious office work constraints. Do post us all…. Prakash

  209. Respected blog Friends, The builders in PUNE have come together and formed their association PBAP for earning unlimited money in short period of time. Through this association they are harrassing the middle class & needy people in PUNE for the sake of greed. So to fight against this financial terrorists & to stop them at the right time, formation of House Buyers Association is need of the present hour. Through this association we all try to get & provide ourselves the dreamhouse at affordable price. So if you find this worth you can contribute your thoughts and join us.. We will meet on 27th March 2009,Gudhi Padwa the auspicious day in Pune.The venue will be decided shortly.So request to spread this message in community and come with friends & family.

  210. Hi Makrand, Excellent!! we can start work from HBA .. I already sent mail to admin :)

  211. Arun Prabhudesai

    To all, Makarand has given an excellent suggestion. We should seriously form an HBA in Pune….and what better place to start than here….I request all of you to let me know who is interested in meeting up offline…. Please mail me at admin@trak.in with subject line “HBA meeting” …If I get enough responses we can get together at designated location over the weekend…I can definitely provide coverage in mainstream media if we have good number of people… So guys lets get together offline now :)

  212. Dear Mr.Arun, Please arrange at least one get together meeting in Pune as soon as possible.So that we can start our association.

  213. we all need to form housing buyers association.(HBA)

  214. Hey Darshit, you are absolutely right. I have writtten multiple times before that a property gets sold for a price WHAT OTHERS ARE READY TO PAY. The problem primarily happened because of NRI folks who put in money at absurd prices for investment sake and by pushy spouses, family members, peers who caused quite a sane lot to make a bad decision of buying at absurd rates. Earlier the prices started rising with builders putting in better construction and little extras like more open space, etc etc. Later it was all whitewashing. Magarpattta – Although a very nice concept – has the worst construction quality. Inflation got the builders increase prices by 10 times the inflation. Then when everyone agrees across the globe that property rates hasve been inflated and will come down to the previous 5 year figure, this infamous PBAP cartel talks crap. I mean how can the chairman or whatever fancy position my LKJ has talk crap like prices in Pune are Rock Bottom! The lone statement itself summarizes this cartel’s thinking. Pune folks are morons. Just fool them and they will fall in the trap. It’s pathetic and things and statements like this only tend to sentiment of the public. Confidence in real estate is in shambles in this city. Its now like buying stuff from Fashion street or Palika Bazar in Delhi. No matter how much you bargain, at the end if you buy it, you would always feel cheated. Hard to see value at any rates now. Why? because again PBAP cartel is saying if we reduce prices quality will suffer. This is just a stunt as the quality is always shit, but what impact do open statements like these have on a buyer. Immediately I see that a rate of 1500psf is not a deal but may be crap construction that would have the building collapse in coming monsoon rains (Check out previous comments where people equate lost cost = crap construction). It is shit everywhere in Pune, and this time (after crash) it is solely PBAP to blame. May be if PBAP acted smartly, we could have seen some bounce after 30-40% correction but definitely not now. Its a free fall as you rightly said.

  215. Darshit wrote, I am reading this article for quite some time and believe me , i had some knowledge that real estate is in shambles but was not ready to believe in it as all my eggs were invested in it. but nevertheless , i have a few observations as well. I am an wrkg professional as most of you all and reading through this blog has given and shown some great thoughts , anticipation and anger on PBAP. as many of us suggest that market needs a major correction till 2005 level. and we purely blame PBAP for this…. are we sure that they are the only culprits here , some how dont we feel that we ourselves contributed to this bully in a major way as well and many of us fellow pros are also suffering buig time and believe me the # is huge. 1)Pune Land of Migrants / growing working class always increasing demand for property and hence ??? 2)we forgot the basic necessity to understand the local Real estate history of Pune , its working / business class ratio and people residing here. 3)We started to buy properties left right and center and i have visited many sales offices in Pune on launch / auspicious days and have seen properties being sold similar to a fish market on a sunday , ?? if you dont pay then and there , that property is sold to someone else …. so who fuelled the greed and here also i am talking abt 2006 / 2007 & the prices were high. but that time IT market was booming and all we thought of 20-30 % increment , anticipating real estate growth in future as well and were proud to make such good investment. if any thought would have given to real estate history and past of pune , this could have been avoided but no , since we saw only positives , (increment and investment) , we went ahead and believe me it was still not affordable but managable .. and now since last year , economic downturn , no increments , job loss , stock market crash , and every other means of investment crashed then how real estate could be left behind. i feel that even if everything above was +ve , our community would continue to invest in real estate even at this high stupid prices? ( people started cribbing only when it started to go beyond their buying capability , if people would have thought about the property actual worth – local market and not buying capability , ths scenario would have never arised.) I still dont understand how come so many people failed to understand what high prices are , did they never fear the impact?? If not why cry now? any place which would be one dimensional faces high risk and same has happened to pune since all it has is working professionals. apart from PBAP , who cares anyways … people who bought before 2005 – safe … people not buying safe , they can enter but a large chunk of similar professionals have bought in 2006 / 2007 — people @ exorbitant prices… and this is the community similar to myself i fear for , and i seriously dont see PBAP solely responsible bcoz we acted real crazy and paying the price big time. we in turn increased the greed for PBAP and hence this result. 1) Greed would then fuel for higher price land auctions.. 2) Ambitious projects launches by Builders have we ever thought because of our actions , (I am talking here of migrants settled in pune) would have killed the native puneite fundamentals and its buying capacity. they never saw the rates even of 2500 for their centre city and here we are talking about 7 / 8 something …. greedy we all were and all paying the price for defying economics , and there is a large sum of professionals with home – 2006 / 2007… Hopefully just for everyone else sake , it doesnt get too bad… I am from Mumbai and have visited pune just couple of times and both related to property , in mumbai we have a fall too but thats global recession and there is no buyer to buy bcoz of -ve sentiments , but prices are 15%(most) – 25%(vfew) down , not more as of now but since this is not one dimensional city depending on a single type of work force transactions happen but pune with prices initially jacking up and now crumbling , i have nothing else but fear. I just wanted to write this because i felt that prices have to correct but correction is good but this is not correction , it is a free fall and if this continues it will impact all recent buyers, & similar to housing bubble in US , and most buyers will soon be underwater , i.e. their outstanding loan amount would be more than the actual cost of the flat and this is not good signs. Ranjeet (any one else), you have been very articulate and were the first person to say that we might see a real estate crash (2007), what is in store ahead and is it going to continue like this – free fall. Let me know.. please reply and share your thoughts … Thanks Darshit

  216. Thanks Arun for the stats and Yeah it is very important to for all people who want to pick-n-post comments to give a LINK BANK to this page else there is every possibility of readers getting biased views or getting distracted from the main course. The real picture of Pune Property is here on this blog-page.

  217. Arun Prabhudesai

    Okay…Here are the stats this post has got more than 28500 pageviews till now and around 275 comments. Also, if anybody wishes to pick up certain comments from this post, they are free to do so (please ensure that it is not significant portion, picking up 5-10 comments is okay ). However, you have to ensure that you need to give a linkback to this page, so that everyone knows about it…

  218. For popularity, we can always get the stats from Arun. Arun, please post. BTW I second Prakash’s point that no one is even going for bookings at sub 200 rates because as we say – the sentiment is not good. We, the people of Pune feel cheated by this PBAP cartel. So all of the sound minded folks now are staying away from properties. On top of this rentals are crashing so there is absolutely no need to buy. Go for multiple year contracts and if possible directly with landlords. Avoid the middleman.

  219. Friend, at many places brokers are jobless… :) they are not getting customers for rent. in my appartment many flats are empty. Baner… kiran more

  220. How is this post too popular?




  224. PBAP needs to look into this: http://www.allcheckdeals.com/project-dlf-newtown-btmextension-bangalore.php You want to know what their response will be? Can;t provide ameneties, construction quality will suffer, they are not using gold bars for extra strength :) as we do. Ha ha ha. Wake up PBAP. There is a huge round of cancellations going in various cities where prices were bloated. Pune seems to top the chart in terms of price bloat. Folks who have already booked should get your bookings cancelled. There is to be a 50%+ drop in present rates. DLF has already shown us that. 1850 = 3700/2

  225. Stay updated on the happenings: http://twitter.com/pune_property Facts published here, self findings and news items will be mirrored on this tweet. Hey Arun, woh Shrini ko permission do bhai.

  226. Our discussion should be notice by maximum peoples.It doesn’t mean only some people know and discuss the facts.So find out the way that how we can reach this messages in Pune city.

  227. I agree with u all that we can ask our friends to visit this link and they can also join us here so we can also get some more views which will be more easy to share between us all and everybody can take benifit from it, after all it’s all our hard earned money we got to take care and help our friends too. We all know in all this cases of property hikes, our government has failed to keep it in control, which has resulted in todays condition, common man can’t even think to afford or to buy a house in good locality or nearby the city, it has also created the haterate feelings in them for IT and BPO industry, where as we know most of the employes in these industries are from middleclass, The Economic crises has arrived at the right time which would change peoples mind and make them think twice in the different way and also some can really have a chance to get there dream house at affordable price. By spreading out our views and gathering more people with us here can really bring revolution which will favour to us and other who want’s to buy house, it will help people to open there eye’s and show them the true picture what is happning around us, how these builders are playing with the society, these builders ware playing game like we have to work for them for rest of 20 years if we buy house/flat from them. i.e. in most cases those who take loan from banks, if we buy a good flat /house we have to take loan from bank, now bank gives that money to builders, then rest of the 20 years we have to pay to bank the double the amount (with intrest) then the bank has paid to builder. now what u say all this is? for me it seems all CRAP and a game that is being played by builders and bankers to take out all the money from ur pocket. think in the different way that builders and bankers are 50-50% partners and the condition is that u have to pay back in 20 years but u get the stuff only worth half of the amount that u pay at the end of the 20 years and there is no guarantee of the things what u get from them that too the property may not be owned by u. now it sounds like that it’s a joke. but that is happning. If more people join us they can atleast give a second thought…. no matter who they are, and we’ll be able to do that in which our Government has failed.

  228. Shriniwas Kulkarni

    Great Work A